Need Help Or Info About HDD ( .HDS ), How Open This In editdisk (Disk Explorer)?

[Sugo77]

Need Help Or Info About HDD Format .HDS For Sharp x68000, How Open This And See For Work With This In editdisk (Disk Explorer)?

Hello!
I use and working in emulators from Computer Sharp x68000:
xm6_typeg_332L30_20201231
xm6_typeg_336_20230523
XM6 Pro-68k

My 2 qesutions:
I have already mastered a lot for a very long time and have gradually delved into a lot of things, understood them for myself, discovered them, and figured them out... But there is still something left that I can't figure out on my own...
I barely figured out on my own how to create a Virtual Hard Disk HDD in .HDF format and install and run games from HDD (.HDF) in the xm6_typeg_332L30_20201231 emulator - it wasn't difficult, but I just can't figure out the HDD format (.HDS) - it's easy to create, but not I may not see it through the editdisk program (Disk Explorer), and emulators don't see it - not in DOS, not in shells ala Windows (Human 68k v2.01 (1989) (Sharp - Hudson), what could be the matter? Can you tell me ? I haven't found any information on this on the Internet... Does it need to be formatted somehow or something? After all, when creating an HDD (. HDF) there is Logical Formatting - formatting, when creating .HDS - there is no... It's the same as on modern PCs, you need to start by formatting the Hard Disks before working with them... editdisk (Disk Explorer) after creating .HDS does not open it at all, or rather does not see it... I have not worked with them before... I also opened it through Human 68k HDD and through Human 68k HDD SCSI In the graphical shell (Human 68k v2.01 (1989)(Sharp - Hudson)) - it also doesn't see... I know, about the walking X68000_V4SP2.HDS created by someone with a bunch of games on it - the system sees it, but I wanted to create my own large HDD (.HDS), and work with it, create it - I created it, and then what?
Of course, I inserted it where necessary, I already learned what was what in the meantime... HDD (.HDF) in SASI (Everything is easy and clear there), I created a new HDD (.HDS) in SCSI (Selecting Internal\Internal) Specifying everything correctly in BIOS, well, boot from what\Boot, etc., etc. I have already mastered the basics over time (For a long time...) But with .HDS I still don't understand...

Tell me, who knows?
I visited foreign forums, and even Japanese ones, read a lot of information, downloaded thousands of files and programs on Sarp x68000 - all in vain...

In other, simple words, withou big text...
This short question:
How to do, what new, empty HDD (.HDS), which i create in \ by use emulators can be visible and usable in editdisk (Disk Explorer)? For work with it...
Need special programs for formating HDD ( .HDS ) before use it or what? (Then which programs? )
Why emulators have option "Do logical formatting" only for HDD ( .HDF ), and do not have for HDD ( .HDS ) ?

Any ideas, who have information about it?
How creators of popular in internet archives  " X68000 " ; "X68000V4" - " X68000_V4.HDS ", with many games in it on HDD ( .HDS ) , have sucesfull with thsi task? WHat they used for it?

Btw, editdisk (Disk Explorer) opened their X68000_V4.HDS...
My new created by me in Emulators of Sharp x68000 empty HDD ( .HDS ) - no...
Any ideas, information, TIP's, Hints?
Need your help, guys... (  Need your information, TIP's, Hints, Tutorials or Lessons )

I want to know, understand, and use HDD ( .HDS ) for - tests, and because this can be have huge sizes of space (Even in Gbs ), much more than  in .HDF ( Which limited just in 40 Mb. )
But, sies not main reason, just want understand - how use .HDS?!
This main, reason, and can't do this task only by myself need your help, who have knows about it and expirence with work with this...

I just know, whta it is possible ( On example with X68000_V4.HDS by developers of this ), just not know how...
Need your help, guys...

2.:
I also remembered the second question:
How to reconfigure controls for 2 players on one keyboard? It only worked out halfway... It was on the xm6_typeg_332L30_20201231 emulator, and it was on this version, because there are 2 Ports with 00 JoyKeys, customizable for 2 players, it is possible on the same keyboard! Only I haven't figured out how to make different arrows yet, but I was able to reassign the buttons to JoyKey Devices A btn.1 Port 1-1 A Button btn 2 Port 1-2 B Button and Devices B btn.1 Port 2-1 A Button btn 2 Port 2-2 B Button, all this gives me in one of the fighting games, different buttons for two players, on one PC keyboard! But, so far I can't reassign the arrows, no matter how hard I tried, and whatever I downloaded, even a certain Joyport U-kun, it is available, by the way, in the latest version (As of today, October 2023, when I am typing this text) of the xm6_typeg_336_20230523 emulator, but there for some reason the usual 00 JoyKeys are not available, it says not found, or the required resources are not available (for some reason) (A required resource was unavailable), although I downloaded a lot, a lot from different sites, even from Japanese ones, from Japanese developers, and from the authors themselves - just a lot of time...
For now, here are 2 questions for experts - people who know, have information, knowledge and experience in this, I'm getting used to the rest, I'm still delving into it on my own, and gradually, step by step, slowly I'm studying everything, experimenting, something new for myself I open it, it opens, and something happens in the knowledge of these old Japanese Sharp x68000 Computers...

P.S.:
I managed to launch games from the Japanese Computer Sharp x68000 on MAME right away...
There, different controls on one keyboard from a PC for two players are easily customizable, and everything else... Everything there is easy, simple, and not interesting...
I would like to fully understand the emulators:
xm6_typeg_332L30_20201231
xm6_typeg_336_20230523
XM6 Pro-68k

[incrediblehark]

Hi, have you tried loading the .hds in disk explorer and under type select the last option which should be x68000 scsi as the disk type? Not at my computer at the moment but can try to help more later.

If you're moving files between hdd images you are better off mounting both in xm6 and transferring files using human68k.

[Sugo77]

incrediblehark, hello!
Yes i have chosed both options in Disc Explorer, and my new HDD ( .HDS ), can't be opened, i mean Disc Explorer can see .HDS, but after when i try open it, then message No Disc...


With X68000_V4SP2.HDS from other authors - all fine, Disc Explorer can open this easy...

I think before need formating this .HDS disk or some, not sure... Then Disc Explorer will be see .HDS
Because after create .HDF we are have option "Do Logical Formatting", when create .HDS - no, and i no idea why... And not know, how we are can formatting .HDS, in full internet information about this 0, Zero, Null. I tried search on english, Japanese, etc sites, forums, etc

[Sugo77]

This second window, and message, always...


And after this, open window, with message "No Disc"...(If chose "Cancel"...
Because, if i try press "Ok", then message will be ask me "Please select a partition", but i no have any for chose...


Btw, in all formats - same...

[Sugo77]

Hm, but wait a second, before this day(24.10.2023), i never not press yet on "Search" in Disc Explorer, when i press on it, then opens tis window, with this message...


"No IPL Device found in 10MB"
This mean, some BIOS Rom's not have for it or what? I have many IPL BIOS'es ROM's on my PC from Sharp x68000...
But, what for? It is depends?
I thik reason not in BIOS'es... In formatting of .HDS, and what i can't do it...

Plus i can open X68000_V4.HDS easy by Disc Explorer, but my new .HDS, no yet...

[incrediblehark]

Ah I see, thanks for the clarification. I use xm6 typeG for my emulator to test images, but I make my .hds image using the built in option in xm6-pro68k. Try that and see if you have better luck with hdd image.

Make the hdd image in xm6-pro68k, then format it in human68k. Should be able to load it up in disk explorer then.

[Sugo77]

then format it in human68k

Explain, please, how?!
This main, what i was need, and asked...

[incrediblehark]

Make sure your created hds is mounted in xm6. Load the the master disk v3 in floppy drive 0. it will load all scsi drivers for you, then run the FORMAT command and it will allow you to set up the partition. The 1st partition can not exceed 1016mb. Max total size is 3000mb

[Sugo77]

master disk v3

Master Disk v3? I still use Master Disc v2...
Can you are share with link on download this, please? ( I was try search after your words, but can't found this in internet...   )
If can here or in PM or in Discord maybe? I not sure, in Discord i also Sugo77, but better here, on forum maybe, for someone else can aslo read this our text, and this information can be helpfull for all!
If this allowed on this forum...

[Sugo77]

Found MasterDisk V3 here...
https://nfggames.com/forum2/index.php?topic=5555.0

P.S.:
Also there, lessons how "Using hard drives which are larger than 1GB"

[incrediblehark]

Good luck, and let us know how it goes!

[Sugo77]

incrediblehark, check me man, what i was do by myself by logic from my head...
I not complete yet...(And not chcked yet, how this will be works in finall after doing this all points...)
I love do all step by step, and not hurry(Slowly, for understand something), so what i was do step by step for make HDD ( .HDS )?!
1.: Open Emulator XM6 Pro-68k
2.: Chose in options - Tools - Create - Fixed Disc SCSI - HDD ( .HDS ) , with sizes fror tests 100 Mb ( In Fact 99 Mb)
Choose Sizes ( Capacity )
Other Options:
Options Must Be On "Attached to interface." And "Replace First Drive."
Press "OK"
Checking What In Options Of Emulator, In Option SCSI - SCSI Interface - Internal - SCSI Discs ( via SCSI Interface ) - Drives ( 1 ) - ID ( 0 ) - SCSI-HD Image File ( .HDS )
3.: After created HDD ( .HDS ), i opened Emulator XM6 Pro-68k , Options - Floppy Drive #0 - MasterDisk_V3
4.: In DOS , in first i typed Command "FORMAT"
5.: Chosed "SCSI Devices" - Enter - "Hard Disc" - Enter - "Initalise" - Enter ( Y ) - "Create" - Enter - "Size"- Enter - Chosed Sizes ( 99 Mb ), by Typed this in window ( In Down Of The Screen ) - Enter -"Start" - Enter - "Create new partition" - "Y" , and got this results in end:

6.: "End" - Enter.
7.: Do you want to reset? Most changes to the Partitions need it... Chosed - "Reset" ( By Press "Y" )
Done!

All correct and done?
HDD Disc, with format .HDS - already created, formatted, can be readable now, now must be visible( In Programs \ Utilities \ In Emulators ), and ready to work? ( For example in Disc Explorer )
Correct or something missed up?

P.S.:
And, one more thing... I really like to write a lot and in detail, describing each point in detail...

[incrediblehark]

Yes that's right, you should be able to shut down the emulator and then load the HDS in disk explorer (don't do it while xm6 is running the hdd image)

[Sugo77]

Done!
This now my .HDS !



incrediblehark, thanks for your help with info, you are master in it!
And good, when someone can share own with own knows, and expirince in something...
Btw, i also love use XM6 Type-G

P.S.:
And simple, small question
Volume label name, can be any?

[Sugo77]

Almost forgot, you are not know about my question 2 something? no - no. maybe this even not possible to do...

2.:
I also remembered the second question:
How to reconfigure controls for 2 players on one keyboard? It only worked out halfway... It was on the xm6_typeg_332L30_20201231 emulator, and it was on this version, because there are 2 Ports with 00 JoyKeys, customizable for 2 players, it is possible on the same keyboard! Only I haven't figured out how to make different arrows yet, but I was able to reassign the buttons to JoyKey Devices A btn.1 Port 1-1 A Button btn 2 Port 1-2 B Button and Devices B btn.1 Port 2-1 A Button btn 2 Port 2-2 B Button, all this gives me in one of the fighting games, different buttons for two players, on one PC keyboard! But, so far I can't reassign the arrows, no matter how hard I tried, and whatever I downloaded, even a certain Joyport U-kun, it is available, by the way, in the latest version (As of today, October 2023, when I am typing this text) of the xm6_typeg_336_20230523 emulator, but there for some reason the usual 00 JoyKeys are not available, it says not found, or the required resources are not available (for some reason) (A required resource was unavailable), although I downloaded a lot, a lot from different sites, even from Japanese ones, from Japanese developers, and from the authors themselves - just a lot of time...
For now, here are 2 questions for experts - people who know, have information, knowledge and experience in this, I'm getting used to the rest, I'm still delving into it on my own, and gradually, step by step, slowly I'm studying everything, experimenting, something new for myself I open it, it opens, and something happens in the knowledge of these old Japanese Sharp x68000 Computers...

P.S.:
I managed to launch games from the Japanese Computer Sharp x68000 on MAME right away...
There, different controls on one keyboard from a PC for two players are easily customizable, and everything else... Everything there is easy, simple, and not interesting...

[incrediblehark]

Congrats! Glad you were able to work it out. And yes, volume label can be whatever you want as far as I know.

I'll look into your other question right now and get back to you

EDIT: Didn't find out exactly how to configure 2 joysticks to keyboard commands. It looks like you probably need to edit the xm6g.ini to accomplish this.

[Sugo77]

incrediblehark, hello again man...
To others question - questions...
You are not know why Disk C HDD ( .HDS ), can't be visible in visual shell ( "Windows" ): Human 68k v2.01 (1989)(Sharp - Hudson) ?
This is possible?
For HDD ( .HDF ), it is work fine!
And in visual shell, how in windows i can work then with .HDF easy, and perfect... But, for .HDS - no... Even can't see...
I do not know why...
Or just because big sizes? Or format .HDS can't be visible in visual shells?

In DOS "Norton Commander" all fine with .HDS, in Windows ( Human 68k v2.01 (1989)(Sharp - Hudson) ) can't see C ( .HDS ), used different settings and BOOT's in BIOS...

P.S.:
I about this:

[incrediblehark]

Is there a specific reason why you're using 2.01 instead of the newest version available?

[Sugo77]

Is there a specific reason why you're using 2.01 instead of the newest version available?

Hm, which new ( Latest ) versions of visual shells ( Windows ) for Sharps?
Me need looks like that or better, if new version available...


P.S.:
I just many years not worked with and not tauch theme SHarp x68000, and not update nothing, main reason...
Now again backed to this theme after many years, but with old files, heh...

[Sugo77]

I can found... But me need understand... Your guesses i can't see HDD ( .HDS ) Disk C, in visual shell, just because old version? Reason in old versions?

[incrediblehark]

Sorry, I was thinking of human68k 3.02, not the visual shell. Did you boot from the floppy or from the hard disk? If you didn't load the shell after booting from the drive and the floppy booted instead, it may not have loaded the hard disk. The link below may help you get the visual shell set up on your system (in Japanese)

https://note.com/uma_japan/n/nb283a861bb5c

[Sugo77]

Yes, i just downloaded many versions, but only human68k version Human 68k v2.01 (1989)(Sharp - Hudson) have Visual Shell...
I about this:

[Sugo77]

Sorry, I was thinking of human68k 3.02, not the visual shell. Did you boot from the floppy or from the hard disk? If you didn't load the shell after booting from the drive and the floppy booted instead, it may not have loaded the hard disk. The link below may help you get the visual shell set up on your system (in Japanese)

https://note.com/uma_japan/n/nb283a861bb5c

From both...
First i was do boot from "Mo Driver at First"
Also, after was try booted from .HDS , with Floppy ( With Visual Shell Human 68k v2.01 (1989)(Sharp - Hudson) ) on, but same fail results... Disk "C" HDD ( .HDS ) not visible...
Even no idea why...
I thnk, maybe because format .HDS can't be visible in Visual Shells or just because big sizes, but i not sure in it...
No idea...

[Sugo77]

Btw, i try trasnalting this in google chrome:
https://note.com/uma_japan/n/nb283a861bb5c
This is so hard to understand...(Because on japanese, and translator not always correct translate full test, and can lost some correct meanings in translates )

Question 1:
This japanese lesson - tutorial for set up \ configure Visual Shell in new versions of Human68k? For example human68k 3.02? Right?

Question 2:
What is "Gradius disk"? ( Translator auto-translated in lesson on japanese, on some like this word - meaning... ) Even not sure, this correct or no... And where i can found this, if this correct? What this is "Gradius Disk"? First time listen about it...
In internet i can found only game, with this name...

[Sugo77]

I understood something...
This was tutorial just on example, with original game Gradius on Floppy?
Not Gradius 2, not modify Gradius, which i found here?
http://retropc.net/mm/x68k/fw/

First Step:
For begin need original Gradius game on Floppy right?
Also: New HDD ( .HDS )
And human68k 3.02?

I can easy found this.. And i have this all, i thnk...

P.S.:
I think this all canl be helpfull?
https://note.com/search?q=%E3%82%B0%E3%83%A9%E3%83%87%E3%82%A3%E3%82%A6%E3%82%B9%E3%83%87%E3%82%A3%E3%82%B9%E3%82%AF&context=note&mode=search

[Sugo77]

Wow, man!
I just found game "Gradius" on floppy in my old collections of games for Sharp x6800, and what i see?!
1.:

2.:


This is game on visual shell...
But, version of Visual Shell \ Human 68k just 1.00
But, anyway, it is first step, and this what we are need for continue work?

[Sugo77]

Hm, can't understand anyway... Need lesson, step by step(On english), for get results...
I saw, how i can understand they have some HDD .HDS(With game Gradius on this inside or what?), and they something change on it...

[incrediblehark]

The original Gradius disk loads up a visual shell, this is what they are using. If you find that disk, boot from your hard drive and copy the following files from the Gradius disk to your root:

VS.X
TITLE.SYS
ICONDATA.VS
CLIP.VS
NOTE.VS
PHONE.VS

create the following directories on your root of HDD: (mkdir command)
TRASH
NEWDIR

remove the Gradius disk then you should be able to run the visual shell by typing VS at the command prompt on your hard drive.

Later on it explains that if you want to run VS at boot you can add it as SHELL in your CONFIG.SYS

[Sugo77]

I have this floppy, with game Gradius, with Visual Sheell (Human 68k ) 1.00
Now i just must put this floppy with game Gradius to my HDD ( .HDS )? ( By using  editdisk (Disk Explorer ) )
And in which format .DIM or .XDF? ( I can convert by using vfic )
And after this, i must boot from my HDD ( .HDS )?
All correct or no in this my steps?

Sorry if wrong and maybe "Face Palm' for you are , i just not pro in it, but alway try learn and got new expirence and knowdges for be better!

[incrediblehark]

No worries - Do not use disk explorer. You need to boot your hard disk you created in XM6. If you copied system files over during the format then it should be bootable. after it boots, insert your gradius disk (will probably be mapped as B:) copy the files I mentioned in my previous post to your A: drive (the HDD). remove the gradius disk, go to A: and type VS and press enter. should start for you.


EDIT - Just want to add if there is a newer version on a Human68k disk you can probably use the same process to run that version on your drive instead.

[Sugo77]

Man, i begin form totally start, zero...
For understand for me all, step by step... ( And not hurry for understand something for myself... )
So, in first ( My First Step , Step 1), i maked new HDD ( .HDS ), with name Gradius ( Just For tests ), after i formating this HDD ( .HDS ), and boot from it, i see now this files inside my new HDD ( .HDS ) by use command dir in DOS

All fine on this step yet?
Next step ( Step 2 ), i must insert Floppy, with game Gradius (With Visual Shell), in Drive 1 ( Not Drive 0 ), right?

[Sugo77]

Was in AFK... Now back...
Now to next steps...
I insert Floppy, with game Gradius to Drive 1 ( b ), and try to changing on b, but nothing happens, then i try on C, and found all files, which we are and was need!

[Sugo77]

Now just need copy all files from B ( In fact from C ) to A, right?
By using this command? Copy c;*.* a; ( Copyall not working forr me, just copy,a nd this anywya will eb copy all files...)

[Sugo77]

Or just need random files copy, about which you are talk before?
Not need copy all files?

But, then by whcih comand?
For example Copy c: VS.X *.* a:

And with others files(From your message) doing same?
All correct?

[incrediblehark]

Sorry for not replying sooner. Yes, you only need the files I listed. The others are related to gradius and other system files.

[Sugo77]

This okay, i not hurry...

This command will be okay? (For copy just one file, not for all. I just always copy all files myself in old time, when worked with Sharps. Never not copied yet 1 file in DOS. Used just comand, for example: Copy c:*.* a: And this will be copy all files then... Not sure about which correct comand for copy separate files...)

Copy c: VS.X *.* a:

and doing all same and for another required files

[Sugo77]

Ops, this is was even here, just checked it only now!... lol After time...
https://note.com/uma_japan/n/nb283a861bb5c

And after spended time also found many basic comands here...
https://nfggames.com/forum2/index.php?topic=5326.0

Now I just tried to read and understand more carefully... Plus apply what you already wrote about above...

Now, with this information and  knowdgess, will try to do something...

[Sugo77]

Sucesfully Done!


P.S.:
Just strange what HDD ( .HDS ) on Disk A( Not on C, how always \ Or not on D, how in lesson from guy from Japan ), but anwyay this is working...

P.S.2.0.:
Interesting, by this method we are can run any other visual shells higher \ newest versions or no?(I was try just run command vs Enter or vs.x in DOS in latest versions of visual shells, but nothing to was to happening in any . I just not copyed not any files from them yet not to any others folders, not in HDD's, etc This not for today... )
Anyway, this is not for today(Here is deep night), and thanks for help...

Or another versions of Humans68k just not have visual shells...

[incrediblehark]

Good to see you got it working! Newer versions of human68k went away from the visual shell and incorporated SX-Window instead. I may add the VS files to my hdd just as a curiosity.

The HDD gets mapped as A: by default because of the way Human68k works. If you want to change it you can edit your Autoexec.bat file with DRIVE commands.

Example:

DRIVE A: C:

(will swap these letters so the hard drive becomes C: and your 2nd floppy drive becomes A. You'd then need another DRIVE command to make floppy 0 ad A and floppy 1 as B:

DRIVE B: A:

If I did this correctly you'll have them mapped as floppy 0 A: floppy 1 B: and HDD C:

[Sugo77]

Wow!
Thanks for this new information(For me new i mean)... This very interesting!
Even before not heared nothing about SX-Window!... And not was know about this nothing...( But, in fact maybe saw something, just not gived meanings to this before, because not was know yet, what this... Hm... Before this day 29.10.2023, i even not was have not one file on my PC with name SX-Window )
Now, after your words... Not only read some about this, and downloaded this and even begin tested this...

And new questions from me about SX-Window...:
1.: You are had working, was doing some tests in SX-Window? ( I mean have expirence and knowdgess about SX-Window ? )
2.: SX-Window can be installed on HDD ( .HDS ) how visual shell ( Windows ), with Visible - Activated HDD ( .HDS ) If talk true, if this newer than Visual Shells previous versions, then ofcourse need use this! And want use and testing this on maximum possibles!...
I guess, this is not simple Installing SX-Window on HDD ( .HDS ) , if possible, but will try ask how, if you are know, and can explain?
3.: I begin tested by unsert SX-Window to Floppy A, and now in WIndow, and even my HDD i can see, but how i can understand, can not use yet? I was try trasnslated by picture( This translators not ideal translate, and this not ideal working ), i understand from this message, first for use HDD ( .HDS ) in SX-Window need again initialize HDD, and Formating or what? But, this my HDD ( .HDS ) was formating and intitalizsed before... This is strange, and maybe i hust not understand something or do something wrong?
There is many menus and options for chose there...