Blaze PS2 VGA adaptor

[TuZhao]

Hi there!
A friend of mine which drooled on my Dreamcast running with a 19" VGA monitor now wants to go VGA himself too, but he owns a PS2  
He saw this Blaze VGA adaptor which claims to output "true" high resolution VGA super signal etc. and he asked me some info. I have yet to see the thing but along the talk we made on the phone he said the word "progressive" a couple of times. I browsed to xploder.net but apparently the VGA box is never mentioned in the site - just cheats and saves and such.
Could it be a progressive signal transcoder? Are PAL PS2 locked like PAL XBoxes and GCs?

Thank you for any info.

[benzaldehyde]

No transcoding here. The PS2 can do VGA, just not very well. It doesn't have dedicated sync lines, and it shuts off the composite video when it enters progressive scan mode. The sync signal is on the green line, which makes it an absolute bitch to get the sync and reduce the green line to be in step with the power of the other video signals. The Blaze cable is great becauise it has all of this circuitry wired in, and is well worth getting over trying to build a cable yourself (personal experience  :angry: ). Since it was marketed in Britain (I've only seen it offered with a pounds procetag), I can only assume Sony didn't lock out progressive scan functionality from PAL consoles. It can be made to work with any game, but it might not work well. It shines with 480p-compatible games, which are few and far between, unfortunately. Heck, I'm looking to get one myself. Have you seen it anywhere? Hope this helps.

[TuZhao]

Whoa, thanks a lot!
Tomorrow evening I'll take a look at the thing and I'll judge the quality.
I always didn't like the PS2 much, but if the progressive scan is available on PAL consoles, that makes the PS2 the ONLY PAL console able to do so!
Kudos to Sony, I bow to thee! B)
Maybe the folks at Lik-Sang have this Blaze box.

[TuZhao]

I've seen it! Whoa, I'm amazed!  
I did not perfectly understood how it works, however. It has 2 options which can be turned on or off: Vertical Size (or scan? can't remember) and Progressive Scan. The first one basicly doubles the vertical resolution for low-res games.
But there are some oddities. GT4 Prologue for example uses progressive scan and is low res, so we activated both options and you get a 320x240 game with crisp pixels and colors.
Then we tried a samurai game (maybe it's called Tenchu or something), which does NOT use progressive scan. But the colors were crisp and nice, and while the screen refresh were more noticeable compared to the progressive scan games, the interlacing caused a sort of "half pixel anti alias" which allowed for a "fake" higher resoution. In other words, it looked better than the progressive GT4 Prologue.
Then my friend popped in the Ghost Hunter disc, which supported both hi-res and progressive, and it was simply beautiful... almost like the DC VGA! The only issue was a white glow along the bottom side of the monitor, very noticeable with dark images - and that game is often dark.
Unfortunately many games simply won't work.
I was wondering how can this thing achieve such great quality with non-progressive enabled games? Is it doing some double scanning taking the RGB signal? The colors was far better than any s-video or component transcoder I've seen so far (but I still didn't see an XRGB-2 at work).

[Kouske]

You can get it here benzaldehyde
http://www.linkerworld.com/catalog/product...f4e66e2ed380df6
http://www.the-console-corner.com/high_res...vga_adaptor.htm

[benzaldehyde]

Thanks, Kouske, but I've actually had one for a few days now. As previously mentioned by TuZhao, the cable works well enough; with Guilty Gear XX (my only prog-scan game), the picture is very sharp with no notable interference or ghosting. The only problem is they didn't drop the green voltage to 0.7V, so the entire picture is green tinted. I had to drop the green element of my monitor to 3/4 the values of red and blue. Then, it looked great! It does come with a little disc that somehow beats other games into progressive scan, but more often than not they're too buggy to play. Also, I have some difficulty with getting it to work; I have to select progressive scan twice for my game because it won't sync properly the first time.

[Kouske]

Just wondering.
But does this look better than playing it on the tv with an RGB cable. :huh:  

[benzaldehyde]

VGA is just RGB at a higher resolution. There are only around a baker's dozen games for the PS2 that support 480p (VGA is essentially RGB 480p), so using a regular RGB cable is best for the system. But yes, for those few games that support progressive scan, it looks much better.

[fragment]

so you don't need to used the supplied software with games that normally have 480p? What country region is your PS2?  

[benzaldehyde]

No, for 480p games no software is needed; you just need to trigger it from within the game. I don't think the country code matters when it comes to VGA, but mine is a US model.

[fragment]

and the green tint can be reduced by using monitor controls? How bad is the green tint and can it be fixed somehow on the cable so it always displays correctly?

[Vidgamer]

and the green tint can be reduced by using monitor controls? How bad is the green tint and can it be fixed somehow on the cable so it always displays correctly?

I have the same questions!  It's disappointing to hear how flawed it is, as it sounds like the best idea for the PS2 so far.

I did try the Dscaler/capture-card method, but I think you guys are right... it can't beat a direct RGB connection.

The worst thing about the cable is how hard it is to find.  Kouske, have you actually ordered from those stores?  After checking http://www.resellerratings.com I'm afraid I'll pass.  

So far, I haven't found a specific diagram for how to wire this, but I want to hear more about how the cable works for y'all before going to that extent.  Does the special software at least work for some games?  Or is it mostly a waste?

[fragment]

anyone? Does S-O-G mean I am S-O-L?

[benzaldehyde]

I found mine on eBay, and unfortunately sync-on-green usually means you're SOL.

I'm thinking about taking the damn thing apart (three little screws; all too easy) and seeing what's under the hood. It can't be that complicated; I'm expecting some buffers and the sync-separator circuitry and little else; it's so small.

If I'm able to diagram the thing, I will. I figure that inserting a resistor into the green line that will drop the voltage to 0.7V would even out the tinting problem; I just have to figure out what resistance that must be.

[Vidgamer]

A number of monitors do not have a sync-on-green problem.

There's a website (that discusses the PS2 Linux) that has a list of monitors that do or don't support SOG.  http://playstation2-linux.com/sog.php  

So, if your monitor should work, does that make the job of making your own cable simpler?

One person on that Linux site says that he doesn't think the Blaze adaptor is that good.  (Seems like it SHOULD be...)

[fragment]

ok here is the deal. I have a Proscan Multimedia monitor that has SVGA and VGA inputs (the SVGA is for HDTV). On that site they don't have my monitor listed, but they do have a RCA Multimedia monitor (a lower end model from RCA) that says it doesn't work. I would imagine that the same would be true for my Proscan but of course there isn't any way for me to test it without buying the adapter! I think it would be safe to assume that it isn't compatible! I haven't had any problems with the Dreamcast VGA connector, but as you know the Dreamcast does a superior job on VGA.

[benzaldehyde]

To Vidgamer: I've found that if you were to point to any random modern-day monitor, there's a pretty good chance it doesn't support sync-on-green. However, I do have one (that barely works), and when I plugged the RGB signals up and booted into hi-res, I got a great, even-colored picture (on GGXX). The Blaze adapter is flawed, but includes the most important part: a sync-splitter to get H and V sync from the green signal, a feat I've tried and failed to reproduce. If I find the proper resistance to drop some voltage off of the green signal, then I'd say it would be a pretty great product.

To fragment: Your monitor may well not be sync-on-green compatible, but if it accepts H and V sync (like standard VGA) then this cable adapter will work. The idea behind the cable is that most people won't have access to a sync-on-green monitor. It will work, but you have to remember only a few games support 480p.

And yes, the Dreamcast was far ahead of its time when it comes to VGA output.

[fragment]

You can get it here benzaldehyde
http://www.linkerworld.com/catalog/product...f4e66e2ed380df6
http://www.the-console-corner.com/high_res...vga_adaptor.htm

ok, so maybe I will give it a shot. Now I saw on that ratings website that these websites got low scores. Any other places that are good resources aside from Lik-sang? Or were these two links good even though someone else wasn't happy?

Also, what is the deal with SOG? Is that a problem when hacking this cable for RGB? I imagine that my VGA does have H and V lines, so in theory it should be fine right?

[RARusk]

The green tint is caused by the composite sync. To remove the tint you must remove the sync.

The best way to do that is by using the EL2150 operational amplifier. It has a special property that will allow you to remove sync signals. Your basic video signal has your video in the positive (+) region of the signal and the sync pulses in the negative region (-). When set up properly the EL2150 will pass the positive part (video) but not the negative (sync). This will effectively chop off the sync pulses removing them from the video signal.

The EL2150 is a 8-pin chip and is easy to hook up:

Pin 4 - Ground
Pin 7 - +5VDC
Pin 3 - Incoming video signal (in this case green)
Pin 6 - Outgoing video signal
Then connect Pin 2 to Pin 6 to make a feedback loop.

Simple and it works. B)

But.....

As it removes sync it also amplifies the signal so you will still have too much green (although black will start looking like black again). Since I have just started playing around with this chip, I don't know what resistor I need to use on the green line after sync removal to get the signal back down to pre sync removal levels. Once that part is figured out, the green tint problem will be effectively solved.

[fragment]

wow, that is good info! So would this chip be placed between the vga adapter and the monitor? I could built a little adapter that would wire up the proper connections, and pass through the other lines correct?

Also, any reason why a Japanese Blaze VGA adapter wouldn't work on a US console? Lik-sang seams to think that it won't work, not even on a US modded console:

Like-sang Blaze VGA adapter FAQ

[RARusk]

Depending on how much room is inside the adapter, you can place the chip (and resistor (still of unknown value)) inside the adapter. You would need to put the chip and resistor on a Radio Shack protoboard and cut it to size. Then look at the underneath of the 15-pin monitor plug.

Find the pin for green and find the last main solder point before that. Then cut the trace between the two points. The outgoing green signal from the EL2150 is hooked up to the green pin on the monitor plug. The ingoing is hooked up to the other solder point. Hook up +5VDC and ground and you should be set.

The EL2150 setup serves as a bypass for the cut green trace to the monitor plug.

[Vidgamer]

Also, any reason why a Japanese Blaze VGA adapter wouldn't work on a US console? Lik-sang seams to think that it won't work, not even on a US modded console:

Note that your link points to the "Japanese NTSC" model.   They also have a PAL model of the cable.  But I could have sworn that they used to have a "US NTSC" model; perhaps they do not sell it anymore.

I would think that what's not compatible is the software boot disc, not the cable, but I dunno!

About building the cable, it sounds like a  lot of work, dealing with the SOG.  Let's say my monitor is on the list as supported.  (Seems to be!)  What do I have to do to make the cable?  Do I connect the RGB from the PS2 to the RGB signals on the VGA connector?  What other signals need to be connected?  (There are no other sync signals, right?  Ground, maybe.)

If it's as simple as hacking a PS2 cable and putting on a VGA connector, I'll give it a shot.  What PS2 cable should I start with?  A component cable, I'd guess, and not an s-video.

[RARusk]

A little update on the EL2150 chip.

Been doing some experimentation tonight, on the EL2150, while trying to build a Component Video to RGB converter. I found that I get good results from running the syncless signal through a 75 ohm resistor to get the signal back down to reasonable levels. Your mileage may vary depending on what monitor you are using.

It may also depend on the console. I found that it looks very nice on the PS2 but comes in quite bright on the Xbox. Need to do some tweaking to accomodate the Xbox.

The picture below was taken from the EL2150 datasheet. The 75 and 150 ohm resistors to ground are optional.

As for building a cable, find a Pelican PS2 S-Video cable. They tend to overengineer the plug part (meaning that all of the pins are there instead of just some). Gently pry apart the plug case (it is not molded making for easy disassembly). Then gently desolder the wires from the posts in the main plug piece.

Now you can easily construct any knid of a/v cable for the PS2 using this plug including a VGA cable. Don't forget your sound though.

I should also point out that on the PS plug page at GamesX the sound pins are reversed. I found this out when playing the music tracks off of the GTA1 soundtrack on the PS2. Double checked with my regular stereo setup and found the error on the PS plug page.

[benzaldehyde]

Hmmm... I have a US NTSC version of the adapter set, but I can't see why the cable wouldn't work as it's just hardware. The software disc that you really won't want to use anyway might not work; no biggie.

RARusk, the actual adapter for the Blaze setup is quite small. I'm not sure how large that IC is; is it SM? Jamming all of that in there with the other circuitry might be difficult; that's why I was thinking of just using the resistor. Dirty as hell, but it might just work.

In other news, I've found just using a normal PS RGB cable wired to a HD-15 plug will pipe an excellent picture into a sync-on-green monitor. Vidgamer, all you'll need are the R, G, and B lines to the monitor, as well as ground, and your audio signals hooked up as well (and preferable shielded ). Thus, all you need is a common PS RGB cable, that is preferably shielded.

I think this IC would only be needed in the cases of monitors that don't know what to do with the extra sync pulse in the green signal (except for making it brighter). I must ask, though, is the sync pulse present only in 31kHz mode, or also in 15kHz mode? I have noticed a bit of green tinting sometimes, though it may just be my eyes. :blink:

[fragment]

question, do you turn on the RGB function when using the VGA adapter? What is the color like with that turned on and off?

[benzaldehyde]

Oh, yeah. I never tried that. Mine's always in RGB because that's the main way I play. I'll check and see.

[RARusk]

The EL2150 can be had as a surface mount. As a matter of fact that was the version given to me by Intersil some time back. If you can find 1/8 watt size resistors (meaning: pretty small), it may be possible to place the assembly within the Blaze VGA adapter. However, since I don't have one, I can't guarantee that it will fit.

The sync-on-green only occurs at 31Khz.

I plan to do additional research on the green tint problem. There may be a better way to deal with it. I'll let you know what I find.

[fragment]

Oh, yeah. I never tried that. Mine's always in RGB because that's the main way I play. I'll check and see.

yeah let me know!

[fragment]

A little update on the EL2150 chip.

Been doing some experimentation tonight, on the EL2150, while trying to build a Component Video to RGB converter. I found that I get good results from running the syncless signal through a 75 ohm resistor to get the signal back down to reasonable levels. Your mileage may vary depending on what monitor you are using.

It may also depend on the console. I found that it looks very nice on the PS2 but comes in quite bright on the Xbox. Need to do some tweaking to accomodate the Xbox.

The picture below was taken from the EL2150 datasheet. The 75 and 150 ohm resistors to ground are optional.

As for building a cable, find a Pelican PS2 S-Video cable. They tend to overengineer the plug part (meaning that all of the pins are there instead of just some). Gently pry apart the plug case (it is not molded making for easy disassembly). Then gently desolder the wires from the posts in the main plug piece.

Now you can easily construct any knid of a/v cable for the PS2 using this plug including a VGA cable. Don't forget your sound though.

so if I want to make my own cable, what exactly is inside the blaze VGA that I would  have to engineer. I used a Mad Catz component video cable to hack, which is a great cable for doing this. It sells for $9.99 brand new at Software Etc/Gamestop. It can easily be taken apart without having to destroy everything. It has a little board in there that allows you to solder to every pin very easily. So what do I need to add for the VGA cable aside from the EL2150 chip,

1 - Ground
2 - Right Audio
3 - Ground
4 - Left Audio
5 - s-video Y for sync
8 - video ground
9 - Blue
10 - 5+
11 - Red
12 - Green

the grounds I can crossover into 1 cable. So I got all of these from a PS2 AV connector to a DB9, so now I can hook that up to a custom box and put necessary components for the VGA cable.

[RM2]

I should also point out that on the PS plug page at GamesX the sound pins are reversed.

For reason(s) I can't begin to fathom, the audio pins are reversed on many (most? all?) the connector pinouts on the site.

Most of these are easy to verify by just doing a continuity check on any system's suppled AV cable. I've gone to double-checking that and everything else I can just to be sure.

[fragment]

yeah, I noticed that post and wired them correctly. It was good that I found out before I had everything completed.

[Darklegion]

The scart format supports outputs and inputs for both video(only composite) and audio.And yes this is a real pain,because some pinouts only show the female side or only the male side....and some get these around the wrong way making the pinout incorrect.Really annoying for troubleshooting when you think you have everyhing right and then you end up finding that it was because of a broken or misleading pinout.
Also RARusk how much did you pay to get one of the EL2150 chips in and did you have to buy in bulk?

[RARusk]

The two EL2150 chips that I have were given to me as part of a sample pack from Intersil when I inquired them about the EL1883 sync seperation chip and possible sync removal (I also got a couple of 1883s as part of the pack as well).

If you go to www.nuhorizons.com you can get the EL2150 for as little as $1.86. I also recently got six additional EL1883 chips from them (I highly recommend the 1883 especially if you plan to watch movies in RGB off the PS2).

I plan to write Intersil's tech support this weekend and ask some additional questions. Based on research (using Google), there aren't a lot of documents that outline how to get rid of the green tint. Most of them were about how to do it within operating systems, like Linux, but nothing on how to do it with hardware. So I plan to ask their fine engineers how they would solve the problem using simple components. There may be a better solution although I feel that the 2150 is going to be a part of it somehow. I'll let you know what they tell me.

[oxtsu]

fragment-- PS2 needs to be in RGB mode, yes.  I had the US version of the Blaze VGA adapter and it worked the same with JP games on my modded system.  The cheapest price I've found ($15+10 shipping) and where I purchased it from : http://www.success-hk.com/pp/success.asp

[fragment]

fragment-- PS2 needs to be in RGB mode, yes.  I had the US version of the Blaze VGA adapter and it worked the same with JP games on my modded system.  The cheapest price I've found ($15+10 shipping) and where I purchased it from : http://www.success-hk.com/pp/success.asp

sweet, that is a good price (even with shipping). I know the JP games will work fine, but from what I gather, the JP Blaze VGA cable is incompatible with a US console (according to Lik-sang and some other retailers).  So is it better to buy one that to make my own?

[opti]

I got the Blaze PS2 adaptor the other day, and tried it just now with Ratchet & Clank: Going Commando in its native Progressive Scan mode, on my 19" ViewSonic A90f+ that I use for my PC.  I tried it multiple times through my switchbox (which my XRGB-2+ is going through), and it wouldn't work (it kept detecting all these funny out-of-range sync rates, but just to make sure I tried hooking the monitor straight up to the adaptor and amazingly enough, it worked!  Good thing too, I got the JPN version from Lik-Sang so the bootup disc won't work on my US PS2.

I'm not sure what this talk of a green tint is all about.  R&C2 displays fine for me, no green tint at all.  I switched back to the XRGB-2+ to make sure it wasn't just subtle, and the colors on the menu screen look pretty much the same.  This makes me very happy, indeed -- I'm not about to hack it up and put some extra chip in there.

btw, I found that success-hk.com (apparently the site of the company that makes the adaptor; the URL is on the box) sells the adaptor too -- they even have the US version, and it's less than half the price of lik-sang at $15 US.  I don't know if they're reputable, but if so that's a much better deal.

[Darklegion]

I believe there was a simple circuit made long ago to fix the green rgb on dvds issue.....many modern modchips can do it as well.By all means find a better way if you can,though

[fragment]

I believe that Benz had trouble on a game, not just DVD's. A game shouldn't have the green tint.

[fragment]

wait, my modchip has this displayed as a feature:

GREEN PROBLEM WITH RGB SCART CABLE
OK ! � FIXED (All PS2 version!!)

http://www.matrix-mod.com/

So apparantly there is a known problem with a RGB cable. I think most modchips solve this problem nowadays. I will test it on my PS2 when I get a chance and see if this is a true. I guess the VGA cable could have the same problems.  

[benzaldehyde]

Hi,

Opti, I'd bet that your monitor can accept sync-on-green. You lucky dawg...

I wonder about that chip. If it can cut the sync addition to the green signal, then that's great. But, it's a modchip, and so must be a pain in the ass to install. I think what he means, though, is the switching of the RGB to component when a DVD is played. This causes a green monochrome picture when viewed through an RGB monitor. Disabling that hardly requires a chip; you only need to short on little thingy to ground. Getting the sync off the green in 480p mode looks be a little more difficult.