Reading a 1.44MB disk in an X68k Compact

Started by TheRogue, November 22, 2009, 07:36:52 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

TheRogue

I notice lots of people are complaining about their inability to transfer files to their X68k compact, but it seems as though with a driver the compacts 3-1/4" drives will read 1.44 MB disks. My Human68k 3.02 system disk came with a driver that allows the reading of many non-x68k standard formats with the regular drive. I don't have a Compact model so I can't test this with 1.44MB 3-1/4" disks however, so I'm wondering has anyone tried this? If they need a copy of the driver I'll be happy to send.
Go up to your brother, kill him with your gun. Leave him lying in his uniform dying in the sun. War, it's never been so much fun.

trap15

I'd love to take a look at that driver. I've always wanted to try to get Compacts working nicely like the rest of the series, so this might help me ;)

trap15

TheRogue, you planning on sending me that driver any time soon?  :-\

TheRogue

I will just as soon as you tell me where to send it :P. PM me your email address and I will send it to you post-haste.
Go up to your brother, kill him with your gun. Leave him lying in his uniform dying in the sun. War, it's never been so much fun.

emerald danjon

hello all,im new here :D,took many years using Sharp X68000, my first sharp  X68000 model CZ-600C few months ago for some kind of problem  the two disk drive  were damaged, is a long time running this model is the most oldest ...I thought it would be good idea to buy one sharp x68000 CompactXVI-CZ-674C because is a most modern computer and thought more or less work to get the games on the run,i have maybe close to 50 original x68000 games obviusly 5/25... :'(,i try ┬Ědiskexplorer"  "winxdf" and no way...I think it's "formatting" problem, is desperate is easy make a disk but x68000 no loads in any way,TheRogue is possible with your driver?how my CompactXVI loads this driver?anyway this driver out from my pc and again the format problem...thanks i will forgive my English is bad i hope you can understand.
my youtube channel dedicated to sharp x68000:
http://www.youtube.com/user/gillianx68000

TheRogue

You need a 3 mode floppy drive before you try to write 3-1/2" disks for the X68000 Compact machines.  This is a floppy drive that is capable of spinning at a different RPM then a regular 3-1/2" drive to mimic the function of a 1.2MB 5-1/4" drive. If you would like me to write you a 3-1/2" with the latest version of Human68k including the 1.44MB driver (so you can then transfer disk images to your Compact and write them to disk using the compact's own drive), PM me with your address and I will send you one.
Go up to your brother, kill him with your gun. Leave him lying in his uniform dying in the sun. War, it's never been so much fun.

emerald danjon

thank you very much TheRogue,i dont understend all because my sharp x68000 experience is "playing"and "playing"but thanks a lot!

sunn

Hi, here is the long needed info: how to format a 1.25 Mb disk with Windows Xp, Vista or 7:

http://assemblergames.com/forums/showthread.php?t=23954

In windows, open up a command box and format discs first using

FORMAT A: /A:1024 /T:77 /N:8 /U

You need a 3Mode Disk Drive as stated earlier OR an USB-disk Drive. Most USB-disk drives are capable of formatting the disks properly. And you don't need a custom or obscure bios on your PC.

Next you need a program called:
DiskImage_13b - Reads and writes disk images.

It's use is pretty straightforward. I had success with all the software I tried. This included Human OS-disk, Castlevania, Dive On, Cho Ren Sha and Shippu Daisakusen.

And these are all XDF image backups from  the internet. But I do own these games on the 5 1/4" format :).

This was a great day for me. Until now, XVI Compact had no value at all in my collection. Now it is my most valued X68K machine. I quickly installed 8 mb memory, toggled to the 16 Mhz and it was all dandy after that :)

This is great news as these games are now all mainstream here in the West and the ebay prices are ridiculous. I bought all my original software from Yahoo Japan and the only game that was over 20 euros was Castlevania!  The ebay did not have that much to offer back then but the prices were at least quite reasonable.

Now it is next to impossible to find a game under 20 e  at the ebay. On the good side, it is relatively easy to find what you are looking for- if you are ready to cough up. This is not all good news, though. Some original software has tricky copy protection that makes bacukps of your own games hard to make. My solution was to buy double copies when the prices were reasonable :). Now I can store even these backups safely. I was getting really restless as some fan paid over 800e from "Castlevania"!  It is hard to play happily the original games on 5 1/4" disks at those prices!

aramokona3

Another information of making a bootable floppy disk for X68000 Compact by using Windows XP and an USB-FDD
http://x68ch.net/bbs/test/read.cgi/x68k/1231891562/248-254

Example
format a: /fs:fat /v: /a:1024 /t:77 /n:8 /y
ntrawrite -n -f HUMAN302.XDF -d a

NTRawrite
http://sourceforge.net/projects/ntrawrite/

sunn

Syntax

Microsoft Windows 95, 98, ME syntax

Formats a disk for use with MS-DOS.

FORMAT drive: [/V[:label]] [/Q] [/F:size] [/B | /S] [/C]
FORMAT drive: [/V[:label]] [/Q] [/T:tracks /N:sectors] [/B | /S] [/C]
FORMAT drive: [/V[:label]] [/Q] [/1] [/4] [/B | /S] [/C]
FORMAT drive: [/Q] [/1] [/4] [/8] [/B | /S] [/C]

In your example you define that the file format is fat and that the label is left blank at this stage(?)

But: "The U is important and is undocumented but means unconditional (ie doesn't save back up information to the disc). "

Either way,  I wish you guys luck :).

I used  a Sony USB Floppy Disk Drive MPF82E. Example http://www.directron.com/mpf82e.html

All disks have copied ok this far.

I already ordered an IBM (Teac) Usb-disk drive as that Sony unit isn't mine. I'll let you guys know how it will handle the job when I get it.




emerald danjon

hi,i have a 3 mode disk drive nec ufooo2 usb,when i do "FORMAT A: /A:1024 /T:77 /N:8 /U"and write adf image dive on for example with disk explorer...dont work  :-\ im trying to find DiskImage_13b but no luck for now...thanks for hopes... ;D many time trying do this  :D

aramokona3

Quote from: sunn on February 17, 2010, 02:43:10 AM
In your example you define that the file format is fat and that the label is left blank at this stage(?)

I've no environment to validate the method.
So I introduced a method that was reported as a success by several users.

I think the fs option and the v option may be not required because the file system and the volume name will be overwritten by NTRawrite.

emerald danjon

#12
finally i found the program DiskImage_13b,and with cmd i open a msdos window,i use FORMAT B: /B:1024 /T:77 /N:8 /U   ,my external usb disk drive "B" and succeeded in creating two boottable disk for my x68k "dive on"and "scorpius"great!well now for some reason I can not come to understand when i try do again"SAME WAY" dont work :o, I open a msdos window and i use  FORMAT B: /B:1024 /T:77 /N:8 /U   and i get "Invalid parameter : /b:1024 "and the external floppy disk drive not recognize disks it created before, is a big nonsense,i understand im doing  something wrong but i dont know what.. thanks in advance.

edit:well  my  girlfriend have a pc portable and works! cho ren ka, flyng shark,nemesis 90  burned!thank you very much!

sunn

#13
Quote from: gillianx68000 on February 18, 2010, 08:28:56 AM
finally i found the program DiskImage_13b,and with cmd i open a msdos window,i use FORMAT B: /B:1024 /T:77 /N:8 /U   ,my external usb disk drive "B" and succeeded in creating two boottable disk for my x68k "dive on"and "scorpius"great!well now for some reason I can not come to understand when i try do again"SAME WAY" dont work :o, I open a msdos window and i use  FORMAT B: /B:1024 /T:77 /N:8 /U   and i get "Invalid parameter : /b:1024 "and the external floppy disk drive not recognize disks it created before, is a big nonsense,i understand im doing  something wrong but i dont know what.. thanks in advance.

edit:well  my  girlfriend have a pc portable and works! cho ren ka, flyng shark,nemesis 90  burned!thank you very much!

Hi, I suggest that you first try to format a regular Win1.44Mb disk, that is, if you are using the same disks over and over again. So if you already used:
FORMAT B: /A:1024 /T:77 /N:8 /U And managed to copy an image to that disk and: want to use that same disk again to another image. I suggest that you first format the disk back to 1.44 mb.  Then you can try again to format it to 1.25 Mb with:  FORMAT B: /A:1024 /T:77 /N:8 /U

And even if you did not :)

My reasoning it that these disk can get corrupted in the process. At least that is quite usual if you are using a transfer disks when copying Atari St(another 16-bit 68000-computer with its own disk format)  files with a PC.

And it is quite easy to get confused with the drive letters :). Windows is hell with its drive letters :).

Sometimes it helps to unplug the usb-drive and then re-inserting it (if Windows itself gets confused with its devices ). Remember to use: safely remove an usb-device. I had transfer hell today with a regular usb-pendrive.

I tried that raw-write program suggested too but managed to do nothing with it.

We still need a way to transfer/copy .dim-images. I for one have only managed to copy .xdf-images.

This is challenging but rewarding :D

When I have working images of my original games collection  I intend to burn them to a dvd-rom for safe keeping. In theory, it is then possible to write them back to the original (5 1/4")  game  disks if needed. I have used this method with Atari St disks and SVI-328 and Sega SC-3000 c-cassette tapes.

There is some images I would like to try even if I do not own the games. I guess that doesn't make me a criminal :).  R + R is one of these games. Has anyone managed to find a working .XDF image?






sunn

Here's the complete guide:

1 Get DiskImage_13b - Reads and writes disk images. From here: http://www.vector.co.jp/soft/dl/win95/util/se076285.html

2. Get .dim to .xdf converter from here: http://www.vector.co.jp/soft/win95/util/se151106.html

When you transfer the files to the xdf-image format they will be bootable in the real machine.

If your transfer disks get corrupted in the process you can use:  FORMAT A: /A:1024 /T:77 /N:8 /U

You do need an USB-disk drive OR a 3mode-disk drive and supporting  bios. That's all there is to it. I recommend using an USB-disk drive with Windows Xp or newer.

With these programs I've had 100% success transfering disks to the real XVI Compact.

And after you have played Cho Ren Sha and other freeware-shmups to your hearts contents here's more inspiration: http://shmups.system11.org/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=15163&hilit=x68000&sid=d8b8822316cfd5bf4e809907d2f77fb5

Now, if somebody has R+R shmup please let me know. Was it indeed commercially available? It looks like a must have. I would gladly settle for a demo image for the time being.




oli_lar

Have PM'd you a link.

R+R is a doujin game so not 'commercial' in that sense, but yes there is a full version but I've never found a dump for it, just the demo. A seller on Yahoo Japan Auctions is selling copied disks of the full version though for about 1000 yen. Someone with a 5+1/2" disk drive needs to buy it and get it dumped  ;)

papa_november

#16
There's also a whole bunch of undumped games besides R+R too: Spindizzy II, Klax, AMS-2, DIRECT-X RELEASE 2, XX FILES R, and there's probably many others.

The Software Preservation Society is working on a device called KryoFlux, which when finished should be able to dump any floppy disk under the sun, no matter how weird or copy-protected the format is. Unlike the Catweasel, the project appears to be actually going somewhere. X68000 support should be trivial, especially since the whole thing is open-source.

NFG

Klax is undumped?  Huh.  Good port, that.

papa_november

Well, technically it IS dumped, but the dump is bad. Same deal.

Magic Knight

I've just been playing Klax now:





Boot from hard disk, insert the disk image and run klax.x, not boot.x

I have  an image of the disk which boots properly, but it's my backup for my original copy, I've no intention of distributing it.

papa_november

Well, that's interesting. It turns out you just need to do a clean boot.

How in the world did I miss that? I could've sworn I tried that, on real hardware even.