Progressive + Widescreen & Standard

[Endymion]

For about a year now I've had a pretty nice Philips 32" widescreen HDTV (I forget the model number and I'm at work ) I've used for the latest consoles via component. 480p and 1080i are supported, there is no 720p; back when I was looking I could only locate one television in my price sub-1500USD range that could do 720p, it was a Toshiba model that was perpetually out of stock so I went with the Philips.

Now that I've had a year to get into the nature of the HDTV and widescreen, I know how much I prefer both, but the odd game or two gives me some squishy-squashy issues. I'm talking about games that support progressive, but send a 4:3 signal. The Philips HDTV apparently handles all progressive images by zapping it to 16:9. I've gotten used to seeing it this way, and some games that others tell me are definitely 4:3 only actually look 16:9 to my eyes (Metal Gear Solid: The Twin Snakes), but others are easily detectable as being squashed (Halo 1, the target reticles are obviously ovaled).

So as much as I liked my first HDTV I am looking at others, but the feature that I want the most, nobody seems to advertise--does anybody know of any HDTV models that allow you to select between 4:3 and 16:9 for a progressive image?

[TJ_Kat]

I have a 42" Maxent (it's some other brand's entry level sub-brand) and it supports pretty much anything. And if I could find my manual, I'd find you the model number too.

It's more than your $1500USD target range, but I'm sure a 32" would be a lot closer. I got it because it was $1000 - $1500 cheaper than anything else comparable and came with a 6 year warranty.

[Endymion]

Is it a projection TV? Call me a stickler, but I don't like the look of projections in general, plasmas are too much price without enough life for my taste, and LCDs tend to the ghosting problems and such. I don't mostly have a limit on the price, but I would like to get a CRT, which are limited to smaller screens than the other HDTVs. If I could get one that would work, either manually or automatically, with 4:3 and 16:9 in progressive mode I wouldn't mind going more expensive on it.

I also have misgivings about handing out any money over to a certain company whose initials sound like "Sony" but if it does what I want, it wouldn't be entirely out of consideration.

[Akir]

FYI, all TVs have modle numbers on the back (Unless they have been removed or the TV is bootleg).

[Bostich]

I have had a 36" Sony Wega CRT (KV-36HS510) for about 6 mos. now.  (I think it was recently replaced by the 420 BTW)  According to the manual it supports 480i, 480p, 720p, and 1080i.  I don't have any games that run in 720p or 1080i so I can't offer any comments there.

You can toggle between progressive/interlaced mode from the remote (if the input signal is interlaced, of course).

You can also manually set it to display 4:3 or 16:9.  It has an auto detect, but it has never automatically changed for me.  I just did a couple of tests...I set F-Zero GX to widescreen, but the TV remained in full screen mode until I told it to display widescreen.  Same thing with Perfect Dark, I set the game to 16:9 widescreen mode and 16:9 cinema mode and neither caused the TV to automatically switch modes.  Also, I put in Rogue Leader and set it to progressive (full screen) and the TV stayed on full screen.

I agree that you just can't beat a good CRT.  Other types of TV's cost 3x as much and have ghosting problems.

[TJ_Kat]

FYI, all TVs have modle numbers on the back (Unless they have been removed or the TV is bootleg).

Yeah, but when you're TV's mounted to the wall, it's kind of a pain to unmount it to find a model number  

That said, yeah, mine's a plasma. /me likes my "floating" wall mounted TV.

[Endymion]

You can also manually set it to display 4:3 or 16:9.  It has an auto detect, but it has never automatically changed for me.

Well either fortunately or otherwise, this is just what I've been wanting to hear.

But it is a little interesting to me that the autodetect has never worked? Do you have any other consoles, like the Xbox for instance? (Consideration here for most of its games being progressive-capable.) It sounds like I could at least get what I'm looking for with this TV but I don't like how this feature doesn't work for you.

Not sure if you're aware of various mode supports for the games in question, but F-Zero does 16:9/480p, I don't know if there is any in-game setting that alters this but it may affect how the TV is picking up the signal. Check out more game modes supported for various stuff here. Yeah I know--I still think Metal Gear Solid: The Twin Snakes must be doing 16:9 properly, but it's a useful reference for games you may not have seen or tweaked with yet.

[Bostich]

Man, this is kinda weird.  F-Zero GX doesn't have an option for progressive.  Rogue Squadron II is the only game of mine I've noticed that has an option for it.  The weird thing is this:  after setting Rogue Squadron II to progressive, then putting F-Zero GX back in, the game now asks me if I want to display progressive mode.  Anyways, progressive mode looks awesome!  Who knows how long it would have taken me to stumble across that on my own, so thanks for making this topic.

Yeah, I have an Xbox, but it is hooked up through composite video right now.  I've been working on upgrading the connection types used by all my systems.  I thought I was almost done until I stumbled across this site and found out you can mod systems to use better connections.  Originally I was just going for the best "out of the box" connection, but now I'm looking into doing the mods.  So anyways, I got sidetracked and never got new cables for my Xbox, Dreamcast, or Saturn.

It doesn't really bother me that my TV doesn't automatically switch to 16:9, because I never use it.  I actually had a 34" widescreen CRT for a short time (about a week), but I took it back for a number of reasons.  Widescreen is great for movies since they are filmed that way, but I have never seen a point to playing games in widescreen.  Even with a 36" TV (sitting 6ft from screen) I find I don't like sacrificing screen area when I don't have to.

[Endymion]

The "standard" way to enable progressive scan for any given Cube game is to hold the B button down, it will ask at boot if you want that mode. If you select yes, at each subsequent boot it keeps asking, but has the default answer set to Yes, so if you do nothing for a few seconds it boots to that mode. My guess is that if you've not see that notice before you didn't have it in progressive mode before.

I've since looked at some Panasonic HDTV widescreen manuals and it looks as if they have several which will do what I want. Panasonic's high end CRT widescreen allows you to switch modes manually, including stretched, nonstretched, fullscreen and "black-bar" 4:3 for progressive as well as interlaced broadcasts, the only mode that has no such option is 1080i.

Anybody in the Miami area want a 10-month used Philips CRT HDTV?

[Bostich]

Since I was just in the market for a new TV last summer, I figured I would add my two cents.  Just something to think about.

You might want to think twice before getting a widescreen CRT.  They're not bad TVs, from what I've seen, but you don't get much TV for you money.  Last I checked the biggest widescreen CRT was 34" and MSRP'd at $2500. (It was a top-end Sony)

I don't know how many movies you typically watch, so maybe it is a better value for you.  But for me, I use my TV for gaming the vast majority of the time.  Out of the ~570 games I own, there are maybe 5-10 that support 16:9.  Which means the vast majority of the time I'm restricted to 4:3.

Now the thing is on a 34" widescreen, once you put it on 4:3 (unstretched) you end up with about a 27.7" screen.  None of the stretch modes I've seen are suitable for video games, IMO.

On a 36" normal screen TV in 16:9 mode you still get a 33" screen.  For comparison, the top-end 36" Sony normal CRT MSRP'd at $1500.  So you get a lot more screen area for your money with a normal ratio TV.

Anyways, I'm not saying don't get the widescreen CRT.  I just thought I would try to save you the trouble of taking one back if you primarily use 4:3.  Those things weigh about 300 lbs.!  It was a bitch taking mine back.  Luckily the store didn't give me any trouble; it was just the reboxing and loading it back up that sucked.

[dj898]

4:3 and 16:9 is matter of taste really
besides you get used to it after a while...
after using PDP since 2002 I'm used to the panorama stretching of 4:3 on 16:9 screen...
sure it looked weird at the beginning but after 2 years of viewing - PDP is our main TV for every day use - it doesn't bother me any more...

[Endymion]

Erm, maybe you missed the bit that I already own a widescreen CRT? I've gone through all of the arguments for CRT v Plasma v LCD v Projection, and widescreen v standard. I want an HDTV that's upwards compatible for sure, that means widescreen, and there are way too many problems with the other technologies--Plasmas don't reproduce black well and are very expensive, LCDs have similar low-light problems and blur, and I can't look at a projection screen without vomiting. I have two 27" RGB monitors so I'm very covered with 4:3, the widescreen HDTV is all about progressive games that will have higher detail than I can get with RGB, stretched or not. The old games I can play 4:3 just fine on my NEC or Sony RGB  monitor, the HDTV is for Xbox, Cube, and PS2 and anything else component capable that comes down the pike for me.

I made this thread because I was beginning to think that there weren't any TVs out there that allowed you to tweak a progressive broadcast's aspect ratio, but I'm glad to learn otherwise. I love the CRT widescreen I have now, it just lacks that one feature. Oh and it weighs 160 pounds.

[Bostich]

Ahh, my bad...I misread your first post.  For some reason I was thinking you had a 32" normal screen HDTV CRT that would also display 16:9.  Not sure how that got stuck in my head.

Possibly because I have a normal screen HDTV CRT that also displays 16:9...   :unsure:

Well anyways, it sounds like you found what you were looking for.