White Saturn - RGB enabled?

[billy_dimashq]

I live in the UK.

Just been given an almost-mint white saturn from a good friend (for modding his xbox). Problem is, when I use it on my telly with either my spider (8-in-1) RGB scart, or my standard Saturn RGB scart, the picture is really, really dark and rolling.

My TV can handle NTSC via RGB, and it works fine with all my consoles, including two UK saturns I've just converted (and intend to sell). Those two work in pal50 and pal60.

I know my TV can do NTSC as my PS2 works fine on it (through rgb - pic is b&w through s-video or composite, but pic doesn't roll)

Does the white Saturn do RGB? If not, can it be enabled using, for example, the HiSaturn RGB mod?

[Endymion]

Any TV that can handle RGB doesn't need to deal with NTSC, or PAL or whatever--it's dealing with RGB. The cable is the most likely culprit, it may not be telling your TV to switch to RGB from the Saturn although it works properly with the other systems. Do you have another separate RGB cable to try?

[billy_dimashq]

no it's not that. the tv doesn't need to be switched as such - it just does it.

also, the fact it works with the two uk saturns and also my jap dreamcast means it can't be the cable

like i said, i've tried my spider rgb and another saturn-only rgb scart. i've got an RF lead somewher that i'd need to dig up and test but i'm sure that'll work (although in b&w due to my tv)

i can spot rgb when i see it, so i'd know if my tv is displaying rgb or not. the point is, this only happens with my jap white saturn. the picture is even darker than an n64 with the rgb mod that hasn't been boosted (and i've seen that - i've done it! it was quite dark too!)

basically, the rolling pic is the odd thing. maybe the saturn was dropped? well i'd be hard-pressed to find a saturn av cable where i am as i dont know of anyone who has one. sure, i could buy one, but then that wouldn't solve anything as i don't want composite (and as mentioned, the tv will display ntsc in b&w)

maybe i should just bite the bullet and sell the saturn, then buy a uk one and mod that to multi-region and pal50/60, end of story...

shame, i like the white saturn

as for the cable not telling the tv to switch, wouldn't it mean i'd be getting no picture whatsoever?

see another thing is, when connecting a console to the tv via rgb scart, if the console is on, then when i change to a terrestrial channel i see the console's output and it's rolling down the screen. this only happens in rgb, not composite

[Aidan]

Dark pictures and rolling images generally indicate a grounding problem. If you're still looking to sell the Saturn, I may be interested in taking it off your hands.

[billy_dimashq]

ok aidan i'll let you know btw it's unboxed, but has a white pad in really good condition. i don't have a stepdown (borrowed one from work as i can't do a psu-swap - the psu only has four pins - 5v, 5v, 3v and gnd, whereas my uk psu's have five pins - 9v,5v,3v,gnd,gnd) but i've got the mentioned rgb/composite-capable scart lead. dunno if it does s-video though

*UPDATE*

I plugged the saturn into my bigger tv (29" sony) that has two scart sockets.

First, I plugged the rgb scart into AV1 (which does rgb and composite) and I got a picture, not dark, but cut off at the top and repeated at the bottom, and all wobbly and colour-changing. I slowly started to pull out the av connector from the saturn av socket and I got a stable picture, in full colour, but composite. If I pushed it back in, the picture was noticeably rgb in quality (no fuzzy stuff) but wobbly etc

Then, I plugged the rgb scart into AV2 (which does s-video and composite). Voila! Picture perfectly stable, no colour probs or wobbles, or rolling or anything. The only thing here is it's in composite not rgb so looks a bit naff (as composite does)

My little TV's issue is it only has one scart socket, and you can't force composite or rgb - you'll get rgb if the scart does it, otherwise you get composite. Wiggling the connector around must have cut the connection with the r,g and b lines thus causing the tv to do composite

[Aidan]

You might also want to check the voltages at the switching pins on the SCART connector when it's connected to something.Ideally, pin 8 should be 5v or above and pin 16 should be between 1 and 3 volts.

Pin 8 is the one that tells the TV that an external device wants to show an image, and pin 16 is the pin that tells the TV that the external device is providing RGB.

I'm trying to think of what other issues could cause your problem, but I'm not having much joy.

[billy_dimashq]

well i'm truly stumped.

see the odd thing is the scarts work fine for my uk saturns it's just this white one giving me hassle

[NFG]

Does wriggling the plug on the saturn end change anything?  From what you describe the problem seems to be internal and I'd suggest it's very possible there's a problem with the AV port, possibly oxidization or - more likely - broken solder joints under the motherboard.  Give it a wiggle or pull the board out and look for cracks under the AV port.

[billy_dimashq]

well the thing is, in composite mode the cable works fine, and the only reason i pulled the cable out a bit was to see what happened. in this case, pulling it out slightly obviously disconnected the red,green and blue pins causing only composite output. this also caused the sound to drop out and crackle due to the audio out pins not connecting properly either.

if i can get my digi cam working i'll take a few snaps of the dodgy rgb in action

[billy_dimashq]

ok it turns out it is to do with the switching/blanking pins

my friend at work told me he had the same problem and it's to do with the fact that the jap saturns don't output enough voltage along the line like the us/uk ones do

thus, he said, to fix it, i should open the rgb cable and remove the resistor between pins 8 and 16, and replace it with a normal wire.

opened the scart lead, but there was no resistor!

ok anyway, using a multimeter, i tested the +5v pin on the saturn's video-out and it read 4.9v or so

good good

now, at the scart end of the connector, i measured all the wires and the blanking wire (which is yellow) was carrying around 2.5v - all the other wires had tiny voltages like 0.2v or so

now, i desoldered the yellow blanking wire (attached to pin 16 on the scart) and i got a steady picture but it was composite (and thus, black and white on my little telly)

i'm gonna solder it only to pin 8 and see what happens...

ok did that and nothing
still just b&w composite

if i touch the wire to pin 16, the screen starts the rolling

i'm gonna try it with the spider rgb cable....

right, opening the spider rgb cable revealed a resistor between pins 8 and 16. sure enough, the 5v pin (well, 2.5v!) was joined to pin 16. joinging it to pin 8 instead (while keeping the resistor in place) caused RGB to work!

suffice to say i'm now enjoying a quick victory game of sfzero2 dash in rgb!