Author Topic: Looking for help with multiple issues  (Read 403 times)

Offline urnhurrell

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Looking for help with multiple issues
« on: April 13, 2017, 01:14:56 pm »
1. I'm in need of a clean copy of Humansoft 68K with a cd-rom driver. If anyone could burn one for me, I'd be forever grateful.

2. I'm looking to either boot games straight off of a cd-rom, or to be able to burn floppies on my x68000 with my cd-rom drive. (I'd heard the latter was possible)

3. How to I go about making/obtaining a user disk for Etoile Princesse? There's an option to make one, but it never seems to write properly.

4. Where do I go to buy the proper floppies to make games/userdisks from?

5. Is all of this going to take more work/money than just buying an AztecMonster?

6. I bought a mouse and it's completely non-operational. Any help with this would be appreciated.

For referrence, my hardware is as follows: X68000 PRO system with 12MB of RAM. Official X68000 Keyboard. Genesis pad adapter and Magical Company pad. Panasonic CD-Rom. MGC  CRT monitor with an adapter (VGA to X68RGB).

Any help is more than appreciated.

Offline SuperDeadite

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Re: Looking for help with multiple issues
« Reply #1 on: April 13, 2017, 09:21:32 pm »
1. I'm in need of a clean copy of Humansoft 68K with a cd-rom driver. If anyone could burn one for me, I'd be forever grateful.

2. I'm looking to either boot games straight off of a cd-rom, or to be able to burn floppies on my x68000 with my cd-rom drive. (I'd heard the latter was possible)

3. How to I go about making/obtaining a user disk for Etoile Princesse? There's an option to make one, but it never seems to write properly.

4. Where do I go to buy the proper floppies to make games/userdisks from?

5. Is all of this going to take more work/money than just buying an AztecMonster?

6. I bought a mouse and it's completely non-operational. Any help with this would be appreciated.

For referrence, my hardware is as follows: X68000 PRO system with 12MB of RAM. Official X68000 Keyboard. Genesis pad adapter and Magical Company pad. Panasonic CD-Rom. MGC  CRT monitor with an adapter (VGA to X68RGB).

Any help is more than appreciated.

1.  No version of Human68k directly supports CD-Roms, but you could add SUSIE.X to a boot disk easily enough.

2.  You can't boot games directly off CD.  Not unless you have some kind of third party patch driver that tells the game software how to use your CD-ROM driver.   The few games that were sold on CD, all require HDD installs.  A couple games can use CD-Audio, but the game data runs off of the HDD.

Based on your amount of RAM, you may be able to place an image burning program on a CD, though I know of nobody who has ever done this.  Most people just copy disk images from CD to the HDD.  It would probably work if you setup a RAM Disk, but I've never done so myself.

3.  Sounds like you have a bad drive or bad floppies.

4.  Any good clean 2HD disks should work.

5.  Considering you have 12mb of RAM, not getting an SD/CF setup is just silly.  The only reason to have that much RAM is to run huge games like Illusion City via Virtual Floppy drives.  And you need an HDD to do that.

6.  Probably full of dirt, clean it.

Offline blur2040

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Re: Looking for help with multiple issues
« Reply #2 on: April 14, 2017, 12:08:39 am »
Floppy Disks: http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-VERBATIM-5-25-DS-HD-floppy-disks-Sealed-box-of-10-5-1-4-floppy-diskettes-/291749929338?hash=item43eda6a17a:g:4aYAAOSw3mpXIUn9 I bought some from this guy.  Seemed like a good price to me.

Mouse: I find it a tad suspect that there is no function at all.  Full of dirt?  That might stop movement of the cursor...but no button function?  My first thought would be to run basic continuity tests on the cable for it. 

Offline urnhurrell

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Re: Looking for help with multiple issues
« Reply #3 on: April 14, 2017, 04:12:57 am »
1. I'm in need of a clean copy of Humansoft 68K with a cd-rom driver. If anyone could burn one for me, I'd be forever grateful.

2. I'm looking to either boot games straight off of a cd-rom, or to be able to burn floppies on my x68000 with my cd-rom drive. (I'd heard the latter was possible)

3. How to I go about making/obtaining a user disk for Etoile Princesse? There's an option to make one, but it never seems to write properly.

4. Where do I go to buy the proper floppies to make games/userdisks from?

5. Is all of this going to take more work/money than just buying an AztecMonster?

6. I bought a mouse and it's completely non-operational. Any help with this would be appreciated.

For referrence, my hardware is as follows: X68000 PRO system with 12MB of RAM. Official X68000 Keyboard. Genesis pad adapter and Magical Company pad. Panasonic CD-Rom. MGC  CRT monitor with an adapter (VGA to X68RGB).

Any help is more than appreciated.

1.  No version of Human68k directly supports CD-Roms, but you could add SUSIE.X to a boot disk easily enough.

2.  You can't boot games directly off CD.  Not unless you have some kind of third party patch driver that tells the game software how to use your CD-ROM driver.   The few games that were sold on CD, all require HDD installs.  A couple games can use CD-Audio, but the game data runs off of the HDD.

Based on your amount of RAM, you may be able to place an image burning program on a CD, though I know of nobody who has ever done this.  Most people just copy disk images from CD to the HDD.  It would probably work if you setup a RAM Disk, but I've never done so myself.

3.  Sounds like you have a bad drive or bad floppies.

4.  Any good clean 2HD disks should work.

5.  Considering you have 12mb of RAM, not getting an SD/CF setup is just silly.  The only reason to have that much RAM is to run huge games like Illusion City via Virtual Floppy drives.  And you need an HDD to do that.

6.  Probably full of dirt, clean it.

Thanks for the response. I'll try to keep the replies in this format to make context easier:

1. Resolved as far as I can resolve it then. Thanks!

2. Same as the above.

3. I have many retail games and all run just fine. I have 2 copies of Etoile Princesse because my original was tested on my normal X68000 with 1MB (Before I upgraded to a PRO with 12) and it would lock the entire system at a specific note in the soundtrack, so I bought a second retail copy. Both did the same thing with the original 68K, so the floppy drives were the problem on that system, and both run fine on my PRO. Not ruling out that the PRO couldn't be a little faulty, but it seems to still be reading and running disks just fine.

4. Thanks for the help with that. It's really hard to know what's dedicated and what's universal with this system.

5. What's your best recommendation for this? I've seen lots of people (all 3 that are interested in the x68000) say that AztecMonsters are great, and I've seen your YouTube video on your setup. My CD-Rom drive came with a scsi 2 cable (I think) and an adapter that fits it to the X68K (scsi2 to scsi1?) I'd love to be able to run every game my system will allow while waiting to run into the physical retail copies (and even after, since I'm very careful about playing the expensive/rare physical media). I used to think I was pretty decent with tech, but the X68 is on a whole other level, so I feel like any tutorial I find would really need to hold my hand.

6. I took the mouse to a friend of mine. He owns a retro gaming store and cleans/repairs hardware. I'd already used some alcohol (for my wits) and then cleaned the mouse on the inside with a q-tip. He was able to read the mouse, and everything came up normal. The only problem is - no response at all. (which coincidentally enough, is a big problem ha)

Floppy Disks: http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-VERBATIM-5-25-DS-HD-floppy-disks-Sealed-box-of-10-5-1-4-floppy-diskettes-/291749929338?hash=item43eda6a17a:g:4aYAAOSw3mpXIUn9 I bought some from this guy.  Seemed like a good price to me.

Mouse: I find it a tad suspect that there is no function at all.  Full of dirt?  That might stop movement of the cursor...but no button function?  My first thought would be to run basic continuity tests on the cable for it. 

Thanks for the link! The above #6 is a response to yours as well.

Offline SuperDeadite

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Re: Looking for help with multiple issues
« Reply #4 on: April 15, 2017, 12:39:05 am »
Reading and writing disks are not the same thing.  Just because you can read a disk doesn't mean you won't have trouble writing to one.  Either way first you should try to format a blank floppy in Human68k, if that doesn't work the game's internal program certainly won't.

Also most floppy drives are in varying states of working.  I had 2 machines at one point, they both would read everything i had except Bosconian.  Only one of the machines would read it.  I swapped the drives, and then the other computer was fine.  Only that one game gave me trouble on that set of drives out of over the the 30 or so retail games I had at that point.

First off, does your CD-ROM drive even work properly on your system?  I don't follow facebook so much, but quite sure you posted a picture of your driver floppy giving you a CRC error (big white box in the middle of the screen).

If that is you, the problem you have is that your PRO does not support SCSI.  Hence, your SCSI CD-ROM and driver will not work.

X68000, Ace, Pro, Expert models are actually SASI based machines.  However the later machines, Super, XVI, Compact, X68030 use SCSI.  This is why the Super goes for so much more then an Expert/Ace/Pro.

The AztecMonster, SCSI2SD, etc are SCSI boards.  You can't just plug them into your SASI based Pro.  They are not compatible.  But, there are 2 ways around this.

SCSI I/O board.  These are quite bulky, but the Pro does have 4 slots, so not a bad upgrade, and usually cheap enough.

SxSI.  Software driver that installs into the machine's SRAM.  It allows SASI machines to use SCSI devices.  This is how 90% of people with SASI machines use the SD/CF boards.  The only issue is that you need to install the driver off of a floppy disk.  So you will need someone to supply you with said disk.

Once you have either working, your SD/CF board of choice is not so important.  These days, most people go with the SCSI2SD as they are cheaper to buy and ship.  Being in Japan, the Aztec costs more but saves me on shipping.  The Aztec also mounts perfectly if you have the original mounting plate.

My vid is very old.  These days I use dual drives.  I have my AztecMonster internally as my main boot drive, and I also have a PowerMonster in an external case as a secondary drive.

Note, there actually is one board that does directly work with SASI.  But it is the most expensive, only sold here in Japan.  SASI support makes it plug'n'play, but SASI has very limited partition sizes.  You can only do like 40mb or so partitions on SASI, as opposed to 1gb partitions on SCSI.

If you plan to use the NFG image, you will need to go SCSI.  The SASI board is only really useful if you plan on doing your own image from scratch.

Mouse could be dead, but you could also have PSU issues starting to creep up.  My keyboard starting acting really weird, sometimes working, sometimes dead, sometimes half-working.  2 weeks later my PSU blew-up.  Swapped in a new one, and no issues since.  You really need to test the mouse on another system to be sure.  Or just buy one, standard mice are quite cheap.

EDIT:  Forgot one other thing.
You said you have 12mbs installed.  So I'm guessing that you have 2mb internal and an XSimmX or something similar in a rear slot.  On X68K machines, RAM has to be configured using SWITCH.X on a Human68K boot disk.  The settings are then stored in the SRAM.  If you don't do this, or your battery dies, SRAM resets, etc.  The computer will only use the default 1mb setting.  It does not auto-detect RAM like most other computers do.  You must setup your RAM manually.
« Last Edit: April 15, 2017, 12:55:06 am by SuperDeadite »

Offline blur2040

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Re: Looking for help with multiple issues
« Reply #5 on: April 15, 2017, 03:28:18 am »
Mouse: So it looks OK, was cleaned and nothing obvious/easy (Ie: the cable) is broken, you're in tough territory.  I would agree with the prior advice that it should be tested on another system.  Obviously, that would give you a definitive answer as to whether its your mouse or your computer. 

Barring testing it elsewhere (likely due to lack of knowing anyone else with an x68k), I'd probably be pondering ways to check things out with the mouse connected to the computer.  Making sure its getting power and transmitting signal back to the computer.  Not that I'd have much clue what to do if I found a problem...


Floppy:  I don't know anything about writing x68k images to disk on an x68k itself, but I can state that its pretty damn easy on a PC.  I got an old 486 from a friend that had a 5.25 drive in it.  I tried using that, it was a bit of a basket case.  Instead, I went to a thrift store, bought an old Dell Pentium III, installed Win2k, moved the 5.25 drive over and was up and running with Omniflop.  Very very easy to write disks now. 

Offline Dal

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Re: Looking for help with multiple issues
« Reply #6 on: April 18, 2017, 05:52:00 am »
If you have a proper X68000 keyboard, you should try plugging your mouse into that.  I had an issue on mine where the mouse wouldn't work when connected to the mouse port on the machine, but works perfectly through the keyboard.

Offline urnhurrell

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Re: Looking for help with multiple issues
« Reply #7 on: April 18, 2017, 11:44:35 am »
Reading and writing disks are not the same thing.  Just because you can read a disk doesn't mean you won't have trouble writing to one.  Either way first you should try to format a blank floppy in Human68k, if that doesn't work the game's internal program certainly won't.

Also most floppy drives are in varying states of working.  I had 2 machines at one point, they both would read everything i had except Bosconian.  Only one of the machines would read it.  I swapped the drives, and then the other computer was fine.  Only that one game gave me trouble on that set of drives out of over the the 30 or so retail games I had at that point.

First off, does your CD-ROM drive even work properly on your system?  I don't follow facebook so much, but quite sure you posted a picture of your driver floppy giving you a CRC error (big white box in the middle of the screen).

If that is you, the problem you have is that your PRO does not support SCSI.  Hence, your SCSI CD-ROM and driver will not work.

X68000, Ace, Pro, Expert models are actually SASI based machines.  However the later machines, Super, XVI, Compact, X68030 use SCSI.  This is why the Super goes for so much more then an Expert/Ace/Pro.

The AztecMonster, SCSI2SD, etc are SCSI boards.  You can't just plug them into your SASI based Pro.  They are not compatible.  But, there are 2 ways around this.

SCSI I/O board.  These are quite bulky, but the Pro does have 4 slots, so not a bad upgrade, and usually cheap enough.

SxSI.  Software driver that installs into the machine's SRAM.  It allows SASI machines to use SCSI devices.  This is how 90% of people with SASI machines use the SD/CF boards.  The only issue is that you need to install the driver off of a floppy disk.  So you will need someone to supply you with said disk.

Once you have either working, your SD/CF board of choice is not so important.  These days, most people go with the SCSI2SD as they are cheaper to buy and ship.  Being in Japan, the Aztec costs more but saves me on shipping.  The Aztec also mounts perfectly if you have the original mounting plate.

My vid is very old.  These days I use dual drives.  I have my AztecMonster internally as my main boot drive, and I also have a PowerMonster in an external case as a secondary drive.

Note, there actually is one board that does directly work with SASI.  But it is the most expensive, only sold here in Japan.  SASI support makes it plug'n'play, but SASI has very limited partition sizes.  You can only do like 40mb or so partitions on SASI, as opposed to 1gb partitions on SCSI.

If you plan to use the NFG image, you will need to go SCSI.  The SASI board is only really useful if you plan on doing your own image from scratch.

Mouse could be dead, but you could also have PSU issues starting to creep up.  My keyboard starting acting really weird, sometimes working, sometimes dead, sometimes half-working.  2 weeks later my PSU blew-up.  Swapped in a new one, and no issues since.  You really need to test the mouse on another system to be sure.  Or just buy one, standard mice are quite cheap.

EDIT:  Forgot one other thing.
You said you have 12mbs installed.  So I'm guessing that you have 2mb internal and an XSimmX or something similar in a rear slot.  On X68K machines, RAM has to be configured using SWITCH.X on a Human68K boot disk.  The settings are then stored in the SRAM.  If you don't do this, or your battery dies, SRAM resets, etc.  The computer will only use the default 1mb setting.  It does not auto-detect RAM like most other computers do.  You must setup your RAM manually.

I think I might look into just getting a floppy drive for my PC then and burning my own floppies that way. I have a Human86K Boot Disk. I set the RAM to 12MB and it's been set to it ever since. Where can a get another mouse? I searched everywhere for the one I have, and it really took a chunk out of my wallet. I normally buy from YahooJP or Saruga-ya. Also, where could I possibly get a 5.25 drive that I can install in (or externally) in my PC? Thanks for all the help.

Mouse: So it looks OK, was cleaned and nothing obvious/easy (Ie: the cable) is broken, you're in tough territory.  I would agree with the prior advice that it should be tested on another system.  Obviously, that would give you a definitive answer as to whether its your mouse or your computer. 

Barring testing it elsewhere (likely due to lack of knowing anyone else with an x68k), I'd probably be pondering ways to check things out with the mouse connected to the computer.  Making sure its getting power and transmitting signal back to the computer.  Not that I'd have much clue what to do if I found a problem...


Floppy:  I don't know anything about writing x68k images to disk on an x68k itself, but I can state that its pretty damn easy on a PC.  I got an old 486 from a friend that had a 5.25 drive in it.  I tried using that, it was a bit of a basket case.  Instead, I went to a thrift store, bought an old Dell Pentium III, installed Win2k, moved the 5.25 drive over and was up and running with Omniflop.  Very very easy to write disks now. 

If you have a proper X68000 keyboard, you should try plugging your mouse into that.  I had an issue on mine where the mouse wouldn't work when connected to the mouse port on the machine, but works perfectly through the keyboard.

I have a proper X68000 Keyboard and tested the mouse. Still nothing :/

Offline neko68k

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Re: Looking for help with multiple issues
« Reply #8 on: April 18, 2017, 12:28:51 pm »
I don't know how to make it more clear that making your own floppies to use is a pointless errand that will not be successful for many titles. Just buy some HDD interface and save your time and money.

Offline urnhurrell

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Re: Looking for help with multiple issues
« Reply #9 on: April 18, 2017, 12:31:38 pm »
I don't know how to make it more clear that making your own floppies to use is a pointless errand that will not be successful for many titles. Just buy some HDD interface and save your time and money.

I mostly want to do this for Doujin titles and userdisks. I'd much rather buy the physical versions of retail releases

Offline SuperDeadite

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Re: Looking for help with multiple issues
« Reply #10 on: April 18, 2017, 10:10:09 pm »
I can't imagine buying and shipping an old desktop pc with a clean working 5.25 2HD drive to your home would ever be cheaper then buying a SCSI2SD....

Offline urnhurrell

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Re: Looking for help with multiple issues
« Reply #11 on: April 18, 2017, 10:14:22 pm »
I can't imagine buying and shipping an old desktop pc with a clean working 5.25 2HD drive to your home would ever be cheaper then buying a SCSI2SD....

But I have to build my own SCSI cable for this and get a dedicated SCSI board for my X68, right? If not, great, but if so, I'd be down for the quickest route, and shipping from sendico is a month-long process

Offline SuperDeadite

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Re: Looking for help with multiple issues
« Reply #12 on: April 18, 2017, 10:23:11 pm »
You don't need a SCSI board.  As stated 90% of people with SASI machines use SxSI driver.  You just need someone to mail you the MasterDisk on a floppy to install it.  Anyone with an X68K and a flash board can write this disk easily.  I could send you one myself, but I'm in Japan and I think you could find someone much closer to you.   If the cable is an issue, just get an old external SCSI hdd and swap out the hdd with the flash board.

Offline urnhurrell

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Re: Looking for help with multiple issues
« Reply #13 on: April 18, 2017, 10:28:35 pm »
Will any hdd work, or are they specific to x68ks, as far as native format goes? Should I make a post for the burn disk in the buy/sell/trade section if I need that?

Offline SuperDeadite

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Re: Looking for help with multiple issues
« Reply #14 on: April 19, 2017, 10:05:07 am »
A SCSI external hdd meets the SCSI standards.  There is nothing unique to the X68K.  Some of the nicer ones might have something custom internally, but the majority of generic external SCSI HDDs are just a normal SCSI HDD plugged into the case. Very simple to swap.

The only thing to be aware of is that there are 3.5" and 2.5" drives.  The 2.5" versions are fairly uncommon though, the cheap ones will almost certainly be 3.5".  If you are worried, it's best to buy your HDD first, open it up and see what's inside.

My external drive actually is the 2.5" size, so I have a PowerMonsterII inside to match.

As for getting the boot disk you need, just ask around.

Offline urnhurrell

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Re: Looking for help with multiple issues
« Reply #15 on: April 19, 2017, 02:10:40 pm »
A SCSI external hdd meets the SCSI standards.  There is nothing unique to the X68K.  Some of the nicer ones might have something custom internally, but the majority of generic external SCSI HDDs are just a normal SCSI HDD plugged into the case. Very simple to swap.

The only thing to be aware of is that there are 3.5" and 2.5" drives.  The 2.5" versions are fairly uncommon though, the cheap ones will almost certainly be 3.5".  If you are worried, it's best to buy your HDD first, open it up and see what's inside.

My external drive actually is the 2.5" size, so I have a PowerMonsterII inside to match.

As for getting the boot disk you need, just ask around.

Is there a better place to get one than ebay? ebay's cheapest is like, $70 shipped, and no guarantee that it's working. Also, where were you saying that I could get a cheap mouse from?