It's that time again...
N64 Stick Converter PCB v3(http://i.imgur.com/eN9ngAR.jpg)
Differences between v3 and v2.x:
- The v3 PCB is easier to assemble because it got larger solder pads.
- Re-enabling calibration mode is much easier, just flip the sliding switch.
- Alternatively execute calibration mode by holding a button combination on the N64 controller while switching on the console. No need for opening the controller & stick to get access to the sliding switch. (optional)
- Extended range mode for higher analog stick values in the diagonal corners. Enabled by holding the R button while turning on the console. (optional)
- Attention: following features from v2.x have been removed:
- Support for bigger analog sticks found in Playstation and Xbox controllers.
- Support for slider joysticks found in the PSP.
- The ability to invert the X- and/or Y-axis. (There is another way to do that)
Installation guide: http://www.mediafire.com/download/jtdtf6ofb2i4ep3/N64+Stick+Converter+PCB+v3+(english).pdf
How to order:Just send me an email: v3@borscht.33mail.com
Please specify the amount of PCB sets you want (maximum = 4) and also don't forget to include your
full shipping address including your
name and
country as one block. I will reply with instructions on how to pay with Paypal. :) No address = no response! 8) Please note that I don't ship to Brazil currently.
Price:
The price for one N64 Stick Converter PCB v3 set is 12€. Worldwide registered airmail shipping is 7€ flat.
Notes:
- Be sure to check your spam folder if you don't get a reply from me.
- No need to ask for availability. As long as you can see the email address above, the PCB sets are available.
v3.5 firmware: http://www.mediafire.com/file/s304xtjtci35mh7/N64_STICK_CONVERTER_FIRMWARE_V3.5.zip
firmware update guide: http://www.mediafire.com/file/w53dq5rkvdpa6hg/N64+Stick+Converter+PCB+v3+-+firmware+update+guide.pdf
Make your own N64 Stick Converter PCB's:I've released the gerber files required to order the PCB as well as the program code. That means you can order, assemble and program the N64 Stick Converter PCB's yourself. :)
N64 Stick Converter PCB v3 - gerber files & microcontroller program.zip (http://www.mediafire.com/download/xchmcr65mbdn1cn/N64+Stick+Converter+PCB+v3+-+gerber+files+%26+microcontroller+program.zip)
Please be aware that you're only entitled to use the files provided for your own personal, non-commercial use. I don't want to see people selling these PCB's everywhere...You can use the included gerber files inside the archive to order the PCB at well-known PCB fabrication houses such as
Itead (more specific: https://www.itead.cc/open-pcb/pcb-prototyping/2layer-green-pcb-5cm-x-5cm-max.html) or
Elecrow (more specific: http://www.elecrow.com/10pcs-2-layer-pcb-p-1175.html).
Make sure you choose the right thickness of 1.2 mm.
The following table contains all the needed parts for the PCB. You might have a very hard time sourcing the analogue stick itself if you're not from Germany. Until now I don't know another source other than the shops listed below. (I can't provide you with the neccessary parts, don't even ask! ^^)
Qty | Description | Value | Package | Mouser.com | Conrad.de | Voelkner.de |
1 | Attiny24A microcontroller | - | SOIC-14 | www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Atmel/ATTINY24A-SSUR | https://www.conrad.de/de/embedded-mikrocontroller-attiny24a-ssu-soic-14-atmel-8-bit-20-mhz-anzahl-io-12-1267301.html | http://www.voelkner.de/products/750674/Atmel-Embedded-Mikrocontroller-ATTINY24A-SSU-SOIC-14-8-Bit-20-MHz-Anzahl-I-O-12.html |
1 | ceramic capacitor | 100 nF | 0805 | http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/AVX/08055C104KAT2A | https://www.conrad.de/de/keramik-kondensator-smd-0805-01-f-50-v-10-kemet-c0805c104k5rac7800-1-st-458043.html | http://www.voelkner.de/products/262399/Kondensator0.1-Uf-10-50v-X7r-0805.html |
1 | resistor | 10 kOhm | 0805 | http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Yageo/RC0805FR-0710KL | https://www.conrad.de/de/dickschicht-widerstand-10-k-smd-0805-0125-w-1-royalohm-0805s8f1002t5e-1-st-1208695.html | http://www.voelkner.de/products/713331/Royalohm-Dickschicht-Widerstand-10-k-SMD-0805-0.125-W-1-0805S8F1002T5E-1-St..html |
1 | sliding switch (optional) | - | SMD | http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/ALPS/SSSS810701 | n/a | n/a |
1 | joystick | 10 kOhm; 60° | 16.7 mm x 16.7 mm | n/a | https://www.conrad.de/de/joystick-12-vdc-metallhebel-gerade-loetpins-98002c6-1-st-425609.html | http://www.voelkner.de/products/69582/3d-Joystick-fuer-Potentiometer-ohne-Schalter.html |
After you've assembled the PCB you still need to program the microcontroller with program code provided inside the archive. The N64 Stick Converter PCB got a standard 6-pin ISP interface for programming the microcontroller. Use the .hex and .eep to program both the flash memory and the EEPROM of the microcontroller. Also stick to the fuse byte settings provided inside the archive.
Source code:If you're interested in the source code of this project, you can download it from
here (http://www.mediafire.com/download/dkhpj6yr9kjm6jc/N64+Stick+Converter+PCB+v3+source.zip).
Note:
It seems there's a new version of the GC-style N64 replacement stick out there. The PCB inside those new sticks looks different from the one shown in the installation guide. At the moment it isn't known yet if the N64 Stick Converter PCB v3 will fit into this new version of the GC-style N64 replacement stick.
If you want to play it safe, please open your GC-style stick and confirm that it looks like the one shown in the installation guide. If it doesn't, then you shouldn't order any N64 Stick Converter PCB's from me. Instead please wait until it's known whether those new GC-style sticks are compatible with the N64 Stick Converter PCB v3 or not. :)
Update: Apparently they also fit into the new GC-style sticks -> msg41280 (http://nfggames.com/forum2/index.php?topic=5803.msg41280#msg41280) msg41297 (http://nfggames.com/forum2/index.php?topic=5803.msg41297#msg41297)
It seems that email forwarding works quite well... ;D
Unfortunately I got some problems with the analog potentiometer joysticks. My supplier (and I only know this source) is absolutely incapable of wrapping up these joysticks properly. They stuff a lot of these joysticks in a small bag. Then they squeeze that bag into a flat cardboard box. No suitable padding at all. It's just insane.
4 out of 5 joystick shipments just looked like this:
(http://i.imgur.com/Bi2BCvul.jpg) (http://imgur.com/Bi2BCvu)
At least they haven't forgotten the stupid flyers... :P
I hope the next replacement delivery is fine (I've had a lot of calls and emails exchanged with the customer support in the last few weeks.) I still got some (but not many) fine joysticks left from that single shipment which was ok for a change. That means shipping of the most packages will be delayed until I finally receive a new replacement batch of the joysticks. It can be helped. :-\
Ahhe that's just awful packaging! A least they are sending you a replacement batch. Hopefully they are packaged properly! Still can't wait to get my hands on these
Hey micro :)
So you found a trick for the diagonal issue, good job !
I'm gonna buy you 2 in order to try this.
Thanks for the updated sticks !
This is exciting, real happy that my lot is already in the mail. Hopefully I'll get a chance to install at least 1 of them before I'll have to start getting ready to move to the house I just bought ;D
Quote from: patsey on March 15, 2015, 07:41:27 PM
Ahhe that's just awful packaging! A least they are sending you a replacement batch. Hopefully they are packaged properly! Still can't wait to get my hands on these
Well, the last two pics show the replacement delivery for the replacement delivery for the original order I've placed and paid like 5 weeks ago. Absolutely insane! :o
Fortunately it seems the problem will be resolved soon - at last! :)
Quote from: Tsurugi_Takuma on March 17, 2015, 05:13:47 AM
This is exciting, real happy that my lot is already in the mail. Hopefully I'll get a chance to install at least 1 of them before I'll have to start getting ready to move to the house I just bought ;D
Haha, shouldn't you be doing some DIY stuff in your new home then instead of playing around with your N64? Just kidding... ;)
I'd also like to mention that the batch is nearly gone. If someone's interested in the PCB, please hurry up and contact me, they won't last for much longer...
Hey I was really interested in getting one of the converter PCBs from you. When I click the email link it doesn't do anything. I was wondering if I could contact you another way?
Quote from: micro on March 17, 2015, 09:11:37 AM
Haha, shouldn't you be doing some DIY stuff in your new home then instead of playing around with your N64? Just kidding... ;)
You're completely right, please don't tell the missus 8)
Will post review here once one PCB is installed properly, but by then all will be gone I guess. Should have bought 100 before the limit was set to 4, could have made a killing ;)
I've got four v2 kits yet. Micro, you once mentioned there'll be a patch available to upgrade the v2 PCBs to the v3's firmware. Could you please give us more information about when the patch will be released and how it will be applied? Many thanks for your good work.
Quote from: themartonfi on March 17, 2015, 12:08:00 PM
Hey I was really interested in getting one of the converter PCBs from you. When I click the email link it doesn't do anything. I was wondering if I could contact you another way?
Strange... Well, the email address was v3@borscht.33mail.com but I fear the PCB's are already gone... I hope you managed to contact me in time.
Quote from: Andy-Antsinpants on March 17, 2015, 07:40:03 PM
I've got four v2 kits yet. Micro, you once mentioned there'll be a patch available to upgrade the v2 PCBs to the v3's firmware. Could you please give us more information about when the patch will be released and how it will be applied? Many thanks for your good work.
Yes, the v3 firmware (or program or whatever you like to call it) is compatible with the v2.x PCB's. I'll make a guide showing exactly what to do. Just give me a break, please! ;)
Updating the v2.x PCB only makes sense if you actually want to use the new features. You'll need at least an AVR ISP programmer. A 6 pin adaptor and some pogo pins are optional but they make the programming procedure a lot easier because in that case no soldering will be required.
If you want to buy the programmer now to be prepared, here are some eBay links:
Programmer: http://www.ebay.de/itm/331211711785
6-pin adaptor: http://www.ebay.de/itm/221686920305
Pogo pins: http://www.ebay.de/itm/400560672835
Thank you so much! The costs for the needed parts seem to be low enough that I'm looking forward to do it by myself once the guide is released.
I have interest in the newest firmware for Perfect Dark and GoldenEye mainly, but I'm sure other games will benefit from the extended range mode feature, too.
I received my kit yesterday. Installation was quite easy. This kit finally restored my N64 controller to a new/better-than-new state. After installing the previous replacement stick, I thought I was just bad at videogames and kid-me was too elite to beat. However, after installing this kit, I can finally aim in Perfect Dark again, not crash into every wall in F-Zero, do spin attacks in Zelda, Smash attacks in Smash Bros, and manoeuvre like a pro in Super Mario 64 again. This kit is worth every cent! If you found this thread through Google, just pray Micro will make a new batch soon, as I can't stress enough how happy I am that I can play my N64 again like I did when I was young!
What, they're already gone? I updated the page every day until I got connection problems because of my ISP (problems started on the 12th), and today it got fixed.
Oh well, I haven't been able to play my N64 for 10+ years, so I guess I can wait a few more years.
Quote from: tim on March 21, 2015, 10:47:37 AM
What, they're already gone? I updated the page every day until I got connection problems because of my ISP (problems started on the 12th), and today it got fixed.
Oh well, I haven't been able to play my N64 for 10+ years, so I guess I can wait a few more years.
You can try this:
http://freneticrapport.blogspot.com.au/2014/10/n64-gc-replacement-stick-ic-swap.html
They're gone already!? Dang, I was hoping to get in on this batch too. =(
Quote from: Lawrence on March 21, 2015, 09:20:21 PM
They're gone already!? Dang, I was hoping to get in on this batch too. =(
Aaaargh, why didn't you just give me your address? I told you that I wanted to give you a free PCB set... :(
Quote from: tim on March 21, 2015, 10:47:37 AM
What, they're already gone? I updated the page every day until I got connection problems because of my ISP (problems started on the 12th), and today it got fixed.
Oh well, I haven't been able to play my N64 for 10+ years, so I guess I can wait a few more years.
Yes, I have to admit that this batch was gone quite fast. Originally I wanted this to be my last batch but I realize that there's still demand for the PCB's. So I will make another one :)
I will accept pre-orders until 4th April 2015; see first post for more informations.
Quote from: blecky on March 21, 2015, 03:54:58 PM
Quote from: tim on March 21, 2015, 10:47:37 AM
What, they're already gone? I updated the page every day until I got connection problems because of my ISP (problems started on the 12th), and today it got fixed.
Oh well, I haven't been able to play my N64 for 10+ years, so I guess I can wait a few more years.
You can try this:
http://freneticrapport.blogspot.com.au/2014/10/n64-gc-replacement-stick-ic-swap.html
Nice! 8) But without the 60° potentiometer joystick the result can't be as good as it should be.
Quote from: micro on March 22, 2015, 03:58:53 AMAaaargh, why didn't you just give me your address? I told you that I wanted to give you a free PCB set... :(
Because I'm lazy and slow, obviously. Are you new here? ;)
Next time! I'll take two please. Put my name down. Take my money!
Quote from: micro on March 22, 2015, 03:58:53 AM
Yes, I have to admit that this batch was gone quite fast. Originally I wanted this to be my last batch but I realize that there's still demand for the PCB's. So I will make another one :)
I will accept pre-orders until 4th April 2015; see first post for more informations.
Perfect mate! I sent a mail! Just so typical that it goes up when my internet goes down. and is sold out when it's back up again :P
Quote from: blecky on March 21, 2015, 03:54:58 PM
You can try this:
http://freneticrapport.blogspot.com.au/2014/10/n64-gc-replacement-stick-ic-swap.html
Thanks, but I can wait for micro's 2nd batch :) something proven to be great and seems easy enough for me to install.
Im probably going to place a pre-order, even if I don't actually use them for awhile.
As an aside, is the installation easy for someone with zero experience in soldering etc? Does anyone offer to replace the board for others?
Thanks a lot.
Hi Traveller, soldering this kit is actually pretty easy. I only have very little experience, and I managed to do it and got it right the first time. The most important part for me was the helping hands. None of the required parts (soldering iron, helping hands, solder, maybe extra wire) are expensive either. You can also buy some hobby kits that cost less than €5 that allow you to practice to get the hang of soldering before actually beginning.
hi and thanks for a quick delivery, super excited about these updated ones!
i have some trouble though, and would be thankful for any input.
Now, i admit i'm an amateur when it comes to soldering, but i have
successfully put together 3 kits from the previous version of the PCB, and
those are supposed to be trickier than the new ones so ;)
Anyway, so far i have put together 2 boards
and they both have the same issue: the control stick has some automatic input, no matter
what i do to the stick, everything just goes around and around. There is no way to steer,
the stick is not inputing when moving it about.
I have checked for bridges etc but can't see with my eyes what is wrong, and since i'm getting the same
result with 2 boards, i'm afraid to try to put together more..don't want to ruin them.
Does anyone of you know what the problem might be?
That sounds somehow like you haven't calibrated the stick (properly). Have you already tried to re-do the calibration?
oh that sounds promising, no i haven't will read up on it and try again, thanks!
Short version:
1) switch off the console
2) open the controller and the stick
3) flip the little sliding switch to the other side
4) re-assemble stick and controller
5) make sure you don't touch the stick and turn on the console
6) move the stick in circles for a few seconds
7) turn off the console
:)
Thank you, you are very helpful!
I tried that now but it's still messed up/same result pretty much.
Never had this problem before but i guess my soldering must be wrong
somehow, it's just that i can't see it.
Well, pictures could be helpful (either post them inside this thread or send me an email).
:-[ well figured it out thankfully, it was of course poor soldering.. thanks for your quick support micro!
Edit: well i know it's the bad soldering now. i have gotten it to work and then after i screwed everything together to play, it was screwed up again.. i guess what i need to do is remove everything and try to do a better solder job.
I've installed one in a controller and tested it with GoldenEye. Working like a charm. Glad i could help you to spot this so you could fix it. Really happy with my new N64 controller :)
I'm definitely going to be placing an order, but I need some help on figuring out where to get the stick and shell at.
If I'm not mistaken the GC Type stick and N64 Type shell is all you really need right? Those GC style sticks on ebay are expensive. Is that what people are doing? Paying 11-12 dollars each for these off of ebay and then gutting the inner board and pot. for Micros design?
I'll buy from these people off of ebay, but if anybody has an alternative or different site to buy from I'd really appreciate the info.
Thanks a lot guys and thanks Micro. You've done a great job. If this is going to be the possible "last batch" what happens to this project? Where do we get the boards and pots from if your not going to supply them anymore? It would be upsetting if this has to die.
Micro stated that it's these pots in the main page for this project:
http://www.conrad.de/ce/de/product/425609/3D-Joystick-L-x-B-x-H-167-x-167-x-182-mm-ohne-Schalter-10-k--20-?ref=searchDetail (http://www.conrad.de/ce/de/product/425609/3D-Joystick-L-x-B-x-H-167-x-167-x-182-mm-ohne-Schalter-10-k--20-?ref=searchDetail)
I'm in the United States. I don't think that site delivers here.
However, could it be possible that I could just copy the specs from these pots and try to find a dealer here in the US?
For the sticks on ebay + the pots and boards that I would be buying from Micro. It's going to cost like 25-30 bucks a controller that I fix. Thats not too bad, considering that they were more brand new back in the day.
Quote from: Majoras Mask on March 25, 2015, 05:03:17 AM
:-[ well figured it out thankfully, it was of course poor soldering.. thanks for your quick support micro!
Edit: well i know it's the bad soldering now. i have gotten it to work and then after i screwed everything together to play, it was screwed up again.. i guess what i need to do is remove everything and try to do a better solder job.
I'm glad you've found the culprit. :)
Here are my soldering tips:
1) If it's possible use standard solder with lead. Lead-free soldering is definitely more difficult. Also make sure your solder has flux inside, because without flux you simply can't get a decent solder joint
2) Set the temperature to 350 °C. (Lead-free solder usually needs a higher temperature)
3) Clean the tip with a sponge so it really shines
4) Adding just a TINY bit of fresh solder to the soldering iron's tip makes transferring the heat to the pad & pin easier
5) Heat up the solder pad on the PCB and the pin simultaneously for about 1 second.
6) Now add fresh solder to your solder joint. The flux removes any dirt/corrosion from the pad and pin and it also decreases the solder's surface tension so it can flow between everywhere, forming a nice solder joint.
Here's also a nice tutorial by some guy running a website called GameSX or so ;D
http://www.gamesx.com/misctech/solder1.htm
And on youtube you'll also find tons of tutorial videos. This one by EEVblog seems to be quite good:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fYz5nIHH0iY
Quote from: MockyLock on March 26, 2015, 05:22:13 AM
I've installed one in a controller and tested it with GoldenEye. Working like a charm. Glad i could help you to spot this so you could fix it. Really happy with my new N64 controller :)
Thanks for the feedback and thanks for pointing out the issue in the first place. :)
Quote from: Syx7h on March 26, 2015, 12:42:27 PM
I'm definitely going to be placing an order, but I need some help on figuring out where to get the stick and shell at.
If I'm not mistaken the GC Type stick and N64 Type shell is all you really need right? Those GC style sticks on ebay are expensive. Is that what people are doing? Paying 11-12 dollars each for these off of ebay and then gutting the inner board and pot. for Micros design?
I'll buy from these people off of ebay, but if anybody has an alternative or different site to buy from I'd really appreciate the info.
Thanks a lot guys and thanks Micro. You've done a great job. If this is going to be the possible "last batch" what happens to this project? Where do we get the boards and pots from if your not going to supply them anymore? It would be upsetting if this has to die.
It seems you're going the wrong way. Usually you get the GC-style replacement stick, you'll find out it sucks hard (1st version) or that it's a quite over-sensitive (current, 2nd version). Then you'll look for a solution and eventually you find this thread and the N64 Stick Converter PCB.
I always suggest to try out the GC-style replacement stick in its unmodded, original state. If you don't see any problems then you don't need my PCB. 8) I really mean it!
It seems this PCB got quite a reputation by now. But if you haven't even played with GC-style replacement stick, how will you know if you need my PCB?
Hey Micro, I've already been around the mountain with 3rd party controllers for the gamecube and can definitely feel the difference between dead zones and sensitivity. Ever since I was a kid 3rd party stuff was always not as good as the original. Something was always too sensitive, not sensitive enough, have a massive deadzone, break after a little use, or have horrible ergonomics (Astropad for Dreamcast)(EA Sports N64 Controller).
I know I can trust people on Gamesx like you Micro to come up with something good, because that's exactly what it's going to take for old consoles to live on. It takes people that love the stuff and that aren't just trying to make a buck.
So is the only place I can buy these GC Sticks is on ebay? Also, do I apply the 2-3 dollar shipping for every single pcb/pot set? 2 pots/pcb = double the shipping? Is that right?
QuoteSo is the only place I can buy these GC Sticks is on ebay?
Yes, these sticks can be bought on ebay or amazon. Someone also suggested https://mortoffgames.com/index.php but it seems they have some problems with their certificate...
QuoteAlso, do I apply the 2-3 dollar shipping for every single pcb/pot set? 2 pots/pcb = double the shipping? Is that right?
No, shipping is always 3.50€ (standard airmail) or 5.60€ (registered airmail) no matter how many PCB sets you're buying. :D
Nice! TY Micro. Ill hopefully be placing my order soon. Unfortunately my car temp gauge went through the roof tonight driving to work. I had to pull over and walk the rest of the way, but it was just up the hill. My grandparents think it may be the thermostat. So hopefully it is. Car repairs can break the bank sometimes.
Thanks again micro, that was very helpful - i followed those steps to the best of my ability.
This is so strange. I used flux (externally added with a cotton cue tip (spelling?)) redid one board,
flicked the switch for calibration and followed the procedure etc
Then, I test out a game a run and have played extensively, to compare the movement with what i'm used to. everything works great. I think i can feel the difference in this upgraded version,
the movements are slightly more responsive, more delicate somehow. Yeah, it's subtle but noticeable.
Everything works great for a decent amount of time, so i'm pretty sure i got it this time.
Then, all of a sudden, it starts moving on its own again. It's so weird that it goes from working perfectly to
playing tricks on me. The exact same result with 2 boards, 2 different joysticks, and also two different connectors, that i have used for this.
When the automatic movement sets in, there seems to be no turning back, no way to
get it ok again, except to start all over with the desoldering, soldering or try a new board.
I guess my soldering gear and soldering ability is not enough, because this time i just can't get it to work
unfortunately. Before i try any more boards i will buy new soldering gear and try stuff to get some more
skills.
Well, you should explain how the automatic movement looks like.
Is it just a very slight and slow movement when the stick is in the neutral position? This is caused by stick which is not returning to the exact point it was when you switched on the controller. This can be cured in-game by pressing L+R+Start. It will set the new neutral position. This is a built-in feature of the N64 controller itself. (not related to the PCB or the calibration)
But if it's like your stick has been fully tilted in one direction suddenly and you can't steer against it, then it's most likely caused by bad / cold solder joints. Especially you should inspect these two solder joints:
(http://i.imgur.com/oseNOJkm.jpg) (http://imgur.com/oseNOJk)
These two pads of the PCB are connected to a ground plane. Soldering the pins to these two pins can be difficult if you got a weak solder iron (<50 Watt). The ground plane is sucking away the heat, the pad and pin just don't get the right temperature. Setting the temperature of your soldering iron to 400 °C can do the trick! :)
Also, externally added flux is ok, but normally the flux inside the solder (if it includes flux) is enough to make some nice solder joints.
Hi Micro,
I was one of the lucky few to order the first batch and I've just built my 4 controllers with them. I picked up a small error in the PCB, the L and Z pads are inverted on each side of the board. Doesn't really matter but I thought you should know.
The other thing is 3 out of 4 controllers are working great, however I have a strange problem with one of them. The controller calibrates fine but when I set it to extended range mode the cursor erratically dips when I rotate the joystick in certain angles. Could this be a problem with the potentiometer? I'm pretty good at soldering so I don't think it's a connection problem but if you can't think of what could be wrong I'll open up the control pad and look again.
Matt
Quote from: matticus on April 03, 2015, 06:04:03 PM
I picked up a small error in the PCB, the L and Z pads are inverted on each side of the board. Doesn't really matter but I thought you should know.
Yes, I'm aware of the flipped description on the bottom side. :-\ But as you said, it doesn't really matter. You can connect L to the Z pad and Z to the L pad, no problem!
Quote from: matticus on April 03, 2015, 06:04:03 PM
The other thing is 3 out of 4 controllers are working great, however I have a strange problem with one of them. The controller calibrates fine but when I set it to extended range mode the cursor erratically dips when I rotate the joystick in certain angles. Could this be a problem with the potentiometer? I'm pretty good at soldering so I don't think it's a connection problem but if you can't think of what could be wrong I'll open up the control pad and look again.
Hmm, that's strange. The problem does only occur in extended range mode? If that was caused by a bad potentiometer then I would guess the problem would also be present in normal mode. Have you checked if the problem occurs in all games?
Still awaiting the arrival of my order! I've been busy lately, so i haven't thought about it, but I'm hoping they'll make it here soon. I picked up a helping hands to help when i have to assemble these things too!
So i got one of mine together and put together. the test rom shows a much nicer circle than the other ones i have.
I can say this for sure though, these work a LOT better for smash brothers than the GC style ones out of the box. When you try to do an up-tilt attack on the other ones, it registers too far too quick, which registers a jump instead. These have a much nicer zone for doing up-tilt attacks.
I still need to wire this one up to allow remote recalibration and extended range, but i was just too anxious to test out the joystick. I got a bit worried after i turned it on and it didn't work at first, but i forgot about the calibration mode =P
these feel MUCH nicer in zelda too, a lot closer to the original. super glad i was able to get in on V3 of these!
Wow, I just started reading this thread and I am very interested in the PCB replacement. I suppose I'll have to wait for the next batch to get one, but is there any chance that the next batch includes a replacement for the restrictor gate so that the extended range is no longer needed? As much as I like the changes that the PCB provides, I feel that it's missing one last thing to have complete 1:1 accuracy with the original stick.
Otherwise, I suppose I can file the plastic myself so that the GC-style stick has the space required, but I'm not sure I can do that carefully enough.
Quote from: Wxma on April 08, 2015, 07:56:57 AM
Wow, I just started reading this thread and I am very interested in the PCB replacement. I suppose I'll have to wait for the next batch to get one, but is there any chance that the next batch includes a replacement for the restrictor gate so that the extended range is no longer needed? As much as I like the changes that the PCB provides, I feel that it's missing one last thing to have complete 1:1 accuracy with the original stick.
Otherwise, I suppose I can file the plastic myself so that the GC-style stick has the space required, but I'm not sure I can do that carefully enough.
I suspect that by the time you file down the restriction piece, you'll be close, or AT the limit of the potentiometer itself. Or the edges of the plastic joystick cap will start to ride on the pcb. The extended range works well. I just tested it, and it does fine for golden eye. The only real "issue" i've found, is that the plastic cap or the restrictor gate could vary the max range a bit of the joystick, so one side might reach a max distance of 80 vs 81 on the other side. its usually quite minimal, but i've actually got some pictures of the test rom showing with the extended range off and on.
http://imgur.com/a/QbOv9
the top image is with extended range on, the bottom is off. Overall, i dont think you'll need to modify anything. Also, if you always want the extended range on, i think there is a way to just bridge a connection to force it always on.
I guess I'm too late to get hold of a few sets from the current batch? Just discovered this thread, and can't believe I missed the deadline by just a few days.. Any chance you'll be making another batch, Micro?
Quote from: andypandy on April 10, 2015, 03:39:25 AM
I guess I'm too late to get hold of a few sets from the current batch? Just discovered this thread, and can't believe I missed the deadline by just a few days.. Any chance you'll be making another batch, Micro?
I'm on the same boat bud.. Came a bit late to the party. Would also like to know if micro has ordered more PCBs in anticipation of people discovering this afterwards.
For those with the v3 already, was the aiming in GoldenEye improved from the last version? Also, is there any side effect to always using this Extended Mode (I believe Blast Corps would become problematic)?
Cheers!
Quote from: wprpalmeida on April 10, 2015, 05:44:55 AM
Quote from: andypandy on April 10, 2015, 03:39:25 AM
I guess I'm too late to get hold of a few sets from the current batch? Just discovered this thread, and can't believe I missed the deadline by just a few days.. Any chance you'll be making another batch, Micro?
I'm on the same boat bud.. Came a bit late to the party. Would also like to know if micro has ordered more PCBs in anticipation of people discovering this afterwards.
For those with the v3 already, was the aiming in GoldenEye improved from the last version? Also, is there any side effect to always using this Extended Mode (I believe Blast Corps would become problematic)?
Cheers!
I could test out blast crops if i knew what to look for difference wise. And I can say that golden eye is improved, at least over the stock gamecube style controllers. I found these after the v2's were out of stock, so i had to wait for the v3's. but the default sticks i had were decent, but way to sensitive to play goldeneye with. these are much better and feel a lot more like the original controller joysticks.
Thanks for your impressions, dav3yb! :D
Quote from: wprpalmeida on April 10, 2015, 05:44:55 AMAlso, is there any side effect to always using this Extended Mode (I believe Blast Corps would become problematic)?
I don't think there would be a problem with Blast Corps, but using the extended range mode always makes the stick more sensitive than using the standard mode. So unless there's a problem with a specific game, I'd stick to normal mode.
Quote from: andypandy on April 10, 2015, 03:39:25 AM
I guess I'm too late to get hold of a few sets from the current batch? Just discovered this thread, and can't believe I missed the deadline by just a few days.. Any chance you'll be making another batch, Micro?
Although we're past the dead line and I've already ordered the PCB's, there are still a couple of PCB sets available. Just send me an email with your address and amount of PCB sets you need. :) (The email link is striked but it should work anyways)
Quote from: micro on April 10, 2015, 09:57:55 AM
Quote from: wprpalmeida on April 10, 2015, 05:44:55 AMAlso, is there any side effect to always using this Extended Mode (I believe Blast Corps would become problematic)?
I don't think there would be a problem with Blast Corps, but using the extended range mode always makes the stick more sensitive than using the standard mode. So unless there's a problem with a specific game, I'd stick to normal mode.
Sent you an email about the PCBs
Also, in Blast Corps the character won't move at all if the thumbstick replacement exceeds a certain range
Quote from: wprpalmeida on April 11, 2015, 02:14:11 AM
Quote from: micro on April 10, 2015, 09:57:55 AM
Quote from: wprpalmeida on April 10, 2015, 05:44:55 AMAlso, is there any side effect to always using this Extended Mode (I believe Blast Corps would become problematic)?
I don't think there would be a problem with Blast Corps, but using the extended range mode always makes the stick more sensitive than using the standard mode. So unless there's a problem with a specific game, I'd stick to normal mode.
Sent you an email about the PCBs
Also, in Blast Corps the character won't move at all if the thumbstick replacement exceeds a certain range
I just tested out some Blast Corps, and I didn't have any issues running around with the controller in default, or extended rage modes. I tested it against one of my normal n64 controllers with a really good joystick, and it seems like the movement was the same. The guy runs kind of runny in blast corps though, so i think any little goofy discrepancies i felt were just me not being used to it. But overall, these seem to do just fine.
Hello again Micro! I bought some your replacement PCBs some months ago(v2.1 I think) and I like them a lot, and I noticed that you recently released a v3. I'm thinking of flashing my older PCBs with your new firmware sometime in the future but I was wondering if there is really any difference between v2.1 and v3 for games other than Goldeneye and Perfect Dark?
Sent you an email, just hope I'm not too late
Am I late? Would like to buy a couple of these, if possible...
I would also like to order 4x PCBs when they next come available
I'm also interested in 4 or so of them.
I'm also wondering - because the GC style joysticks have slightly limited range, has anyone shaved off some of the plastic to get it to be the right shape to produce the proper range? I'm thinking of using a dremel to get the shape identical to the stock joystick, but I'm wondering whether or not it would be actually beneficial.
Hello I would also like to order 4 PCB v3 if I'm not to late. I live in the US and would be willing to pay the shipping cost. Thanks
Hello.
I would like to order four N64 joystick PCBs.
Is that still possible? I know about the deadline but I just discovered your project.
Thank you for all your work. It seems amazing and I can't wait to try it.
Best regards.
To the 4 or 5 guys above me: If I haven't replied to your emails, then you've been too late indeed. The good news is that right now there are a couple of the PCB sets available again. Use the new email address (see 1st post) to contact me if you're still interested.
Also, I had to increase the price of the leftover PCB sets slightly...
Quote from: Catastrophic on April 11, 2015, 04:06:10 AM
Hello again Micro! I bought some your replacement PCBs some months ago(v2.1 I think) and I like them a lot, and I noticed that you recently released a v3. I'm thinking of flashing my older PCBs with your new firmware sometime in the future but I was wondering if there is really any difference between v2.1 and v3 for games other than Goldeneye and Perfect Dark?
To be honest, I don't know if any other games that show a difference. Maybe Super Smash Brothers? IIRC there's a jumping test where you execute a diagonal with Yoshi to land on a building? Apparently if you can land on the building that means the stick's range is good enough to pull off the crazy moves, I don't know. ;D. Well, when I tried it once back then, I couldn't even pass the test with genuine Nintendo analog stick in good condition, so I don't know how relevant that test really is. But I could imagine that with the extended range mode you could jump further.
Got mines this morning, thanks micro ! :D
But they are green and not red like in the first post, this won't look good inside of the joystick !! just kidding lol ;D
I'm trying to install this now in one of the six controllers I'm going to use this in. But I can't for the love of god reattach the plug to the controller PCB... Soon I'm going to break out the sledge hammer :'( That is now officially the worst piece of shitty plastic on this god forsaken planet. Everything else with the installation was a breeze, except cleaning out all the gunk out of the controller hehe.
F it, gonna go unpack my new tv and cool off! UHD for my N64 ;-)
Edit: Ohhh I see now. The idiots who made the replacement stick used a totally different plug than the original, that is so retarded that I'm speechless. They take the time to make a replacement stick, albeit totally useless, but the don't take the time to make it possible to install. Awesome...
Sorry for my rants...
Edit 2: Used a small screwdriver to lift the plug up from the PCB while pushing it in place...
Edit 3: Board works perfect for the 10+ games I've tried it with so far. Solid work Micro, thank you so much for this excellent contribution to the gaming community.
Hello guys.
I ordered 4 PCB and can't wait to try them ;D
Could you give me a link (or a few ones) to buy the Gamecube Style Joysticks?
I found some cheap ones on amazon.com but the shipping is more than 30 dollars to send them to europe...
I'm always late to the party with cool stuff like this!
Any chance you'll be doing another batch?
yes i want in with one! i asked about a 3ds slider, in a pm. if you could help me with that id like that a lot. (if possible, there was a user by the name RDC who made it possible before, but i lost contact with him)..sadly, but he was someone i met from a different forums which shut down too.
I just want to add my interest to the list and request that you please make another batch of these. I suspect that the only reason more people aren't on here begging for another batch is because they don't even know it exists. I'm not going to sick all of NintendoAge and Reddit GameCollecting on you since it looks like you want to make these in small quantities, but I suspect that if they knew your board existed you would have a much larger demand. ...especially if someone got into the business of modding the new board/joysticks into controllers on the behalf of others.
People are hoarding N64 controllers and resorting to really lackluster solutions in hopes of having functioning controllers into the future when you have the perfect solution right here. Your board is precisely what I've been looking for and it was surprisingly difficult to find this thread via Google.
Please make another batch! :)
Hello.
I just received my PCBs, thanks.
I also agree with the post above. Launch a crowd-funding campaign and make some communication.
I am sure you will succeed in no time.
Have a nice day
Quote from: y0da on May 29, 2015, 05:33:00 PM
Hello.
I just received my PCBs, thanks.
I also agree with the post above. Launch a crowd-funding campaign and make some communication.
I am sure you will succeed in no time.
Have a nice day
After reading your post it got me thinking about the feasibility / profitability of a KickStarter or something. One selling SNES and Genesis component cables made over $40,000 (https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/hdretrovision/sega-genesis-and-super-nintendo-component-cables).
Looking at one big eBay store (http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-REPLACEMENT-Joystick-for-Nintendo-64-Controller-Repair-N64-Thumbstick-Pad-/380952838594?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item58b28f01c2), it looks like they've sold over 1,200 replacement joysticks for $8.95. They also have an Amazon storefront, so let's just say they've made similar sales there. That's around $22,000 or €18,000 in gross revenue for a single vendor.
It's possible that if enough hype was generated and if the product were streamlined, that he could beat that, but it would need to be more accessible to the end-user:
1) Soldering everything is a problem for your typical consumer. It would need to come prefabricated within the joystick.
2) If it needs to be prefabricated, then it should also probably come pre-calibrated and have a calibration switch that is accessible through the joystick box's plastic. That's a lot of man-hours to fab it up, find a manufacturer, test, and calibrate, etc.
3) Extended range mode might need to be addressed, preferably by fabricating a modified joystick box that has a border more closely resembling the original's shape, making extended range mode unnecessary. It could also just be stated that if you want this you'll have to solder a single wire from the PCB to the N64 controller board, which is much less intimidating than soldering the potentiometer on, etc.
As for marketing, I think a video would need to be made demonstrating why people should want this that directly compares it to the V2 gamecube-style joystick. It would need to show the difference in sensitivity and demonstrate that you CAN do with this PCB what you CAN'T do with the standard V2 replacement joystick.
If Micro was willing to address the fabrication and marketing sides, he could stand to make a lot of money that people would gladly give him. The question is... How much of the market is untapped and how big of a market is out there?
If he ever went the KickStarter route we might be able to throw a sticky up on /r/gamecollecting (http://www.reddit.com/r/gamecollecting) to raise awareness since I'm one of the mods over there, but I haven't gotten to try the product yet so no promises :P
Very excited to try my one board out when it arrives.
I've been looking to replace my 4 v1 boards but I keep missing the boat on these new batches... :-\
Any new batches coming soon? I totally need to play Smash 64. ;D
Hello everyone, Im from Brasil and after hours searching how to improve my N64 controller, I found this amazing forum and that amazing job made by Micro!( really thanks I loved it micro )
I want some PCB v3 too; new batches are coming ?
Micro, was extremely hard to me find this.
I already knowed about the existence of something that improved the sensitive from the GC style thumbstick, but after months I found it!!
Quote from: Junior on June 05, 2015, 04:22:15 PM
Hello everyone, Im from Brasil and after hours searching how to improve my N64 controller, I found this amazing forum and that amazing job made by Micro!( really thanks I loved it micro )
I want some PCB v3 too; new batches are coming ?
Micro, was extremely hard to me find this.
I already knowed about the existence of something that improved the sensitive from the GC style thumbstick, but after months I found it!!
Micro told me he needed a break when I PM'd him a while back, so I doubt he'd do another batch until late 2015 at the earliest. ...but that's complete conjecture. There are a lot of us who want to order a few, so you're not alone in hoping he'll make more :)
I love this project and I'm dying to get one to fix my favorite over sensitive controller, could you please contact me in some way when it's available again?
Hey Micro,
I know you are not accepting orders right now, but I'm hoping that by posting my order on here now, that I may get an email when there is a response. I would like four of these adapters whenever you start making them in the (hopefully near) future.
Thank you Micro for helping us Nintendo Nerds keep our beloved games alive! ;)
Great work micro! :D I just had a few questions about the 'extended range mode' if you dont mind...
So I understand that the original N64 analog stick restrictor is more a square-ish octagon shape, rather than a true octagon like the GC style sticks (Not my pic):-
(http://i.imgur.com/lv4gl2Hl.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/lv4gl2H.jpg)
Heres a picture of a new original N64 analog sticks range taken with sanni's N64 controller test rom:-
(http://i.imgur.com/w6BkFwk.png)
The original N64 converter used 168 steps (Which I think was based on the up-down, left-right analog stick measurements?) which means if you use a replacement analog stick with an octagonal or circular restrictor you end up with these ranges:-
(http://i.imgur.com/agiLtfh.png)
Red = Original N64 Restrictor
Blue = Octagonal Restrictor (GameCube/Wii Style)
Green = Circular Restrictor (PlayStation/Xbox Style)
This means you dont quite have the maximum range for the diagonals, which is the problem experienced by MockyLock with GoldenEye/Perfect Dark using v2:-
http://nfggames.com/forum2/index.php?topic=5023.msg35647#msg35647
Does the 'extended range mode' try to modify the analog stick values into a more square-ish shape, or does it simply extend the range using the number of steps for the diagonal size, like this?:-
(http://i.imgur.com/gVHaUZ0.png)
In which case the 'extended range mode' has the full range of an original N64 analog stick, but slightly more range in some directions than originally intended (Plus if you have a limited area of movement [Small restrictor] like some of the third party GC style analog sticks, then the stick could be too sensitive)
I'm also curious to know what the maximum number of steps is for the original diagonal ranges? I'm guessing around 190 steps? (13% increase) and would a value somewhere in between the two (Perhaps 180 steps) work for GoldenEye/Perfect Dark?
I just personally would prefer to have 'one mode' for all games - even if that means I have to compromise slightly with more range for some games than originally intended :)
Interesting question, Link. I'm also curious as to whether the joystick would calibrate properly if I carefully modified the octogonal gate to match that of the N64's gate. With some careful measurements and markings and a file I imagine you could get very close to perfect.
Or... If, the angles would be too severe with a 18mm and 20mm measurements, you could leave the cardinal directions at 16mm and carefully file the diagionals out to ~17.8mm, and the ratio would be faithful to the .9 ratio of the N64 controller's gate points.
Quote from: Informationator on July 17, 2015, 05:00:44 AM
Interesting question, Link. I'm also curious as to whether the joystick would calibrate properly if I carefully modified the octogonal gate to match that of the N64's gate. With some careful measurements and markings and a file I imagine you could get very close to perfect.
I believe this should be possible based on micro's reply to MockyLock in the old thread:-
Quote from: micro on May 09, 2014, 08:04:20 PM
2) cut out the corners
It's possible to enlarge the octagonal gate in the corners by using a file/dremel/sanding paper. I guess it would be hard to enlarge all four corners equally. And of course this is not reversible!
I'm not sure how you would calibrate it though, since I assume the stick converter calibrates by measuring the largest available range on the replacement analog stick? With a modified restrictor this would be the diagonals, which I think would mean you wouldnt gain anything and would in fact lose range in the up-down/left-right directions. Perhaps you would have to permanently enable the extended range mode in order to gain any benefit? Hopefully micro can help answer :)
Damn missed out!!
Enjoy the break Micro. Put me down for whatever next version you make or if you every write that easy to guide for programming the V2 boards to have the features of V3 as I got 10 of them sitting on my desk lol.
If you ever do a kickstarter let me know I would be all in on that too haha.
Quote from: Link83 on July 17, 2015, 09:21:30 AM
Quote from: Informationator on July 17, 2015, 05:00:44 AM
Interesting question, Link. I'm also curious as to whether the joystick would calibrate properly if I carefully modified the octogonal gate to match that of the N64's gate. With some careful measurements and markings and a file I imagine you could get very close to perfect.
I believe this should be possible based on micro's reply to MockyLock in the old thread:-
Quote from: micro on May 09, 2014, 08:04:20 PM
2) cut out the corners
It's possible to enlarge the octagonal gate in the corners by using a file/dremel/sanding paper. I guess it would be hard to enlarge all four corners equally. And of course this is not reversible!
I'm not sure how you would calibrate it though, since I assume the stick converter calibrates by measuring the largest available range on the replacement analog stick? With a modified restrictor this would be the diagonals, which I think would mean you wouldnt gain anything and would in fact lose range in the up-down/left-right directions. Perhaps you would have to permanently enable the extended range mode in order to gain any benefit? Hopefully micro can help answer :)
I have sufficient reason to believe it would indeed calibrate properly in case the shape of the restrictor gate were to be altered. Here's why:
The calibration routine will only look for max/min values for X and Y. Remember that this is a coordinate system, it's as if you had a Cartesian Plane to put your inputs on. Any diagonal points will have its coordinates smaller (or at best equal, when you think of a square) than the maximum or minimum values for X&Y, so the polygon shape you see on the screen of the Analog Stick Benchmark is exclusively dictated by the shape of the restrictor itself.
Quote from: wprpalmeida on July 24, 2015, 10:35:28 PM
I have sufficient reason to believe it would indeed calibrate properly in case the shape of the restrictor gate were to be altered. Here's why:
The calibration routine will only look for max/min values for X and Y. Remember that this is a coordinate system, it's as if you had a Cartesian Plane to put your inputs on. Any diagonal points will have its coordinates smaller (or at best equal, when you think of a square) than the maximum or minimum values for X&Y, so the polygon shape you see on the screen of the Analog Stick Benchmark is exclusively dictated by the shape of the restrictor itself.
Now that I think about it some more your absolutely right :)
This yellow square should denote the 'theoretical' maximum unrestricted range available using micro's converter in the default mode:-
(http://i.imgur.com/xu1c2in.png)
So modifying the shape of the restrictor should work fine as an option.
----------------------------------------------
I think its interesting that Nintendo's designers seemingly couldn't decide between a circular or square restrictor, so came up with the 'compromise' shape used in the final controller:-
(http://i.imgur.com/VV9X6Lgl.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/VV9X6Lg.jpg)
You can see this thought process in the patents for the N64 analog stick, in which they describe how different types of game may require a circular or square shape.
http://www.google.co.uk/patents/US5963196
Heres some info from the patent:-
(http://i.imgur.com/hGyIlF1m.png) (http://i.imgur.com/hGyIlF1.png)
Quote from: Patent 5,963,196In the above described embodiment, the guide ring 486 of the analog joystick 45 has the octagonal outer edge 491, and therefore, the lever 474 can be inclined within such an octagonal range due to the outer edge 491 of the guide ring 486. However, according to the game content, it is required to regard that the lever is inclined within a circular or rectangular range not the octagonal range. A case where the substantially inclinable range of the lever 474 is a circle as shown in FIG. 38 is called as "circle mode", and a case where the substantially inclinable range of the lever is a square is called as "square mode". In a case of the former, although the lever 474 is actually inclined within the octagonal range due to a restriction by the octagonal outer edge 491, in a step S4, a movement of the lever 474 is corrected into a circle range shown in FIG. 38. In a case of the latter, in a step S5, the movement of the lever 474 is corrected into a square range shown in FIG. 40. "Circle mode" is preferably applied to a game that it is desirable that the joystick data is not changed according to the inclined direction of the lever 474, a game that the movable character is moved in all the directions on the monitor screen in response to the direction and amount that the lever is inclined, for example. "Square mode" is preferably applied to a game that the lever 474 is inclined toward left or right at a state where the lever 474 is inclined toward front or rear at its maximum inclination position, such as the aforementioned racing game.
----------------------------------------------
Some additional thoughts I had...
According to Nintendo's SDK documentation the GameCube analog stick (Or 'control stick') has a range or 174 steps before dead zone clamping:-
(http://i.imgur.com/iyfxUt0m.png) (http://i.imgur.com/iyfxUt0.png)
Given that the N64 and GameCube controller protocols are so similar (Both use a serial data interface which could support analog stick values from 0-255) and that the 174 steps figure is so close to the 168 steps micro measured for a new N64 analog stick, one has to wonder if 174 steps was the actual maximum range Nintendo originally intended for the up-down, left-right measurements.
Also, having done a bit of 'pixel counting' I think the diagonal ranges might actually be 15% larger than the up-down/left-right ranges - so if we took 174 steps as the actual intended value, this gives a diagonal a range of 200 steps. Hmmm...
Quote from: Link83 on July 26, 2015, 12:37:53 AM
Quote from: wprpalmeida on July 24, 2015, 10:35:28 PM
I have sufficient reason to believe it would indeed calibrate properly in case the shape of the restrictor gate were to be altered. Here's why:
The calibration routine will only look for max/min values for X and Y. Remember that this is a coordinate system, it's as if you had a Cartesian Plane to put your inputs on. Any diagonal points will have its coordinates smaller (or at best equal, when you think of a square) than the maximum or minimum values for X&Y, so the polygon shape you see on the screen of the Analog Stick Benchmark is exclusively dictated by the shape of the restrictor itself.
Now that I think about it some more your absolutely right :)
This yellow square should denote the 'theoretical' maximum unrestricted range available using micro's converter in the default mode:-
http://i.imgur.com/xu1c2in.png
So modifying the shape of the restrictor should work fine as an option.
----------------------------------------------
I think its interesting that Nintendo's designers seemingly couldn't decide between a circular or square restrictor, so came up with the 'compromise' shape used in the final controller:-
http://i.imgur.com/VV9X6Lgl.jpg
You can see this thought process in the patents for the N64 analog stick, in which they describe how different types of game may require a circular or square shape.
http://www.google.co.uk/patents/US5963196
Precisely.
And regarding the range for the N64 and the Gamecube, I believe that the difference in nature of the sensors (optical vs. A/D-converted from a voltage divider) cause the increase in range from 168 to 174. This would give a deadzone of 3 steps in each direction to accomodate the fluctuation that is inherent with a potentiometer-based joystick, but again, this is just my opinion on the matter.
EDIT: big images in quotes
Quote from: Link83 on July 15, 2015, 12:57:48 PM
I'm also curious to know what the maximum number of steps is for the original diagonal ranges? I'm guessing around 190 steps?
There are about ~83-85 steps for up/down/left/right and diagonally the x/y values are between ~67-70 on a new controller.
So the overall "traveling distance" between e.g. the lower left and the upper right corner would be the square root of ((2*68)²+(2*68)²) so about 192.
Sanni,
Is the device you're using to test the coordinates of the controllers and produce those diagrams available for purchase somewhere or is it custom? It'd be nice to be able to perform some tests, especially if I did end up modifying the gate.
Quote from: sanni on July 30, 2015, 02:03:43 AM
Quote from: Link83 on July 15, 2015, 12:57:48 PM
I'm also curious to know what the maximum number of steps is for the original diagonal ranges? I'm guessing around 190 steps?
There are about ~83-85 steps for up/down/left/right and diagonally the x/y values are between ~67-70 on a new controller.
So the overall "traveling distance" between e.g. the lower left and the upper right corner would be the square root of ((2*68)²+(2*68)²) so about 192.
Great to see you here sanni! :)
Thanks for the readings, so using your measurements and this octagon calaculator:-
http://www.had2know.com/academics/octagon-measurement-calculator.html
I calculated that when using an replacement stick with an octagon/circular restrictor using micro's N64 stick converter the diagonals can only reach 59 steps (Without extended range mode) but the measured diagonal value for a new analog stick is 68 steps due to the different shape of the N64's restrictor.
So to use an analog stick using an octagonal/circular restrictor:-
-168 steps (the current value) gives a diagonal value of 59 steps (Not enough for GoldenEye/Perfect Dark)
-192 steps is the maximum required to give a diagonal value of 68 steps (The same as a new N64 analog stick)
-180 steps is exactly inbetween the two, and should give a diagonal value of 63.5 steps (Perhaps enough for GoldenEye/Perfect Dark?)
----------------------------------------------
I dont know if this will just add confusion, but since I last posted I managed to find some info in the N64 SDK which is quite interesting:-
(http://i.imgur.com/PBjguGjm.png) (http://i.imgur.com/PBjguGj.png)(http://i.imgur.com/tc5dEXdm.png) (http://i.imgur.com/tc5dEXd.png)
However the 'new' analog stick measurements ("Initial Values") appear to be considerably different to our already measured values? The only way I can get the figures to come close to our measured values is if the XA and YA values (The dead zone or 'center stop width') is meant to be 14 steps - 7 steps in each direction, not 7 steps in total. In addition, it would appear that the calculations at the bottom are wrong(?) since based on the diagram/table they are subtracting 7 steps from a figure that already has 7 steps removed. Maybe i'm reading it wrong, or perhaps there was a mixup when the original Japanese SDK was translated by NOA.
Anyway, by my guess if Rare programmed GoldenEye/Perfect Dark to still work correctly with a 'used' analog stick ("Values after 500 direction changes") then the YCM value of 61 steps (54+7) is the minimum diagonal target we need to meet - this means that a value of 173 steps should 'in theory' be enough when using an octagon/circular restrictor. However if we wanted to mimic what Nintendo defines as a 'new' controller, then the YCM value is 63 steps (56+7) which leads to a maximum value of 178 steps.
----------------------------------------------
I'm probably looking into this too much! but I just thought there would be a more accurate intended value. Perhaps we should just work out the best number of steps by gradually increasing the converters range until we meet the value required for GoldenEye/Perfect Dark's diagonals to work correctly.
Great find Link83. 8)
I think that those values are just minimum specifications, so basicly the lowest thumbstick values a developer must make sure his game still works with and not the maximum values a new controller should give.
Only one way to find out(see attachment :o)
Mario starts moving in Super Mario 64 at 8 and starts running(arms go back and forth fast) at 60.
In Goldeneye the crosshair starts moving in the menu at 6. In game the character starts to turn at 7 and with R-Targeting the crosshair starts to move at 2. While R-Targeting you don't start turning until you go past 60, with a speed increase at ~66 and another slight one around 68-70.
Seems to me like RARE didn't follow the guidelines set in the development manual which explains why Goldeneye makes so many problems. :P
@Informationator, it's just an Arduino Uno with a sketch I wrote, you can find the source here (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=amOAOTS9nOA). It's easy to build if you don't put it in such a small case ;)
Hehe, good to see that this little issue i spotted lead to a huge tech discussion.
I must admit i'm a bit lost in all your chit-chat, but at least, i learn a lot !
Thanks, Sanni! I can't access that link at the moment but I'll check it out and might make a little project out of it if it's within my abilities.
If micro's anything like other engineers I know, he loves problem solving and perfecting designs, but probably isn't terribly fond of the sales and shipping sides of selling the boards.
I wonder if this might inspire a new revision? Or would this not necessitate any design changes? Like MockyLock, some of this is just out of reach for me since I don't know the norms around steppings relative to the latest revision of micro's board.
can anyone say if there is going to be another run of the PCB v3 boards? I would like to buy one. Also, I've read that while the knew version of the GC style sticks fixed the spin attack/smash attack issue, they are still not properly setup? is this the case/is the micro PCB mod still necessary?
I have been searching for a replacement stick for my N64 controller. I think that a "GoFundMe" or "Kickstarter" approach for a big run of ready-to-install sticks could be possible for Micro. The other 3rd party replacements are pretty poor precision. I bought a potentiometer-based "original looking" N64 stick and it's looser than a real Nintendo N64 stick after years of use. If the GameCube stick, potentiometer and V3 board restores it to new or better performance, then we have a winner.
What I liked about the N64 stick was the quick aiming and precise movements. It wasn't jittery nor over sensitive near center, and still gave a wide range of motion. The newer consoles' controllers (Xbox, Playstation) have a large dead spot in the center followed by what feels like positive exponential curves. On top of that, the stick movements feel like they are in lower resolution steps. That combines to make fine movements difficult. Aiming in the remastered Perfect Dark on Xbox 360 is jittery almost like a Nintendo Wii nunchuk. No other games jitter, but you can feel something like steps. I haven't perused a solution for the Xbox/Xbox 360 yet.
I think any problem that people encounter with the OEM GameCube stick is firstly the exponential, or range compression (as opposed to limiting), if applicable, imposed by the circuit and 38 degree potentiometer. The second version of the GameCube stick is favored over the first, but it's more sensitive by skipping steps. A second factor that may have become an issue for the OEM GameCube stick is the bezel shape reduces the diagonal stick travel, just like what was pointed out on the previous page. I'm not certain if the electronic hardware or software compensates for this diagonal movement even with the original N64 stick. I noticed that games on N64 that relied upon a single stick for gas, brakes and steering would slow down when making turns where the stick was departing from TDC (top dead center). Xbox sticks also do this. If the bezel was square, it might be able to apply hard turn while still having full throttle.
Quote from: Fretless on August 18, 2015, 07:35:28 AM
can anyone say if there is going to be another run of the PCB v3 boards? I would like to buy one. Also, I've read that while the knew version of the GC style sticks fixed the spin attack/smash attack issue, they are still not properly setup? is this the case/is the micro PCB mod still necessary?
As for "will there be more?" ...that's entirely up to Micro.
As for if it's still necessary... I'm going to go out on a limb and say yes. I have a single V3 board from him and I haven't been able to install it yet (My tripod was tied up in another project and I wanted to make a nice video out of it), but I did install the version 3 "gamecube style" replacement joystick (had "V3" on the back, not to be confused with Micro's v3 circuitboard) and while it is MUCH better than a worn out joystick in terms of usability, it is too sensitive. CircuitTrace pretty much covered the technical details, but I'll give you some real-world examples:
Mario Kart 64 - I can powerslide very effectively with an unmodded joystick, but where you notice the oversensitivity is when you need to make fine adjustments on a straightaway, or any small movement. Unmodded joysticks tend to take you farther than you want to go and on one occasion (I think) led to a spinout on 150cc that I likely wouldn't have gotten with an accurate-to-original joystick.
Goldeyene 007 - Again, the compression of range/sensitivity shows in the fine movements you try to make. When you're using R to use the crosshair, you'll overshoot your target. This is especially noticeable when you're trying to get a headshot, or on places requiring precise shooting like the lock on the chainlink gate on the Dam level. I imagine it'd be really frustrating trying to shoot remote mines or proximity mines in multiplayer with the unmodded joysticks.
I'll be tied up for the next week or so, but I'm hoping to solder micro's v3 kit together next weekend and make a nice video out of it including gameplay showing what I'm talking about. I'll post it where when I'm done.
Hey guys, I went ahead and made that video. I have the YouTube video as unlisted right now which means only those with the link can view it. Please don't share the link, because I don't want Micro getting bothered by people who might see the video. For now, I'm only sharing it with this community and a few friends. Hope you like it!
https://youtu.be/7UivhfH6AhU
That's a very nice video, good job! :D
At the moment I don't plan on making another batch of the N64 Stick Converter PCB. Ordering the sticks is just a PITA. It's so much trouble to get these delivered without all pins bent.. Also I'd like to mention that during the last batch there was a considerable amount of people who contacted me to express their interest in the PCB, but then never responded nor paid. This kind of behaviour really pisses me off...
EDIT: Kickstarter or crowdfunding in general for the PCB won't happen either... But stay chilled. I don't plan on taking the source code/PCB layout to my grave. Once I'm certain I will never make another batch, I will release the files. But the question is if people would really benefit from that without having a source for the 60° joysticks outside of Germany... :/
Quote from: micro on September 12, 2015, 09:42:11 AM
That's a very nice video, good job! :D
At the moment I don't plan on making another batch of the N64 Stick Converter PCB. Ordering the sticks is just a PITA. It's so much trouble to get these delivered without all pins bent.. Also I'd like to mention that during the last batch there was a considerable amount of people who contacted me to express their interest in the PCB, but then never responded nor paid. This kind of behaviour really pisses me off...
Thanks! I really love how your mod turned out. I've done a lot of trades and eBay sales and can understand how infuriating it is to deal with unreliable people...
Have you considered using something like Kickstarter or gofundme where people would have to pay you in advance? Or, you could just make prepayment a condition for preordering to weed out the buttheads.
Or, if you're just sick of all of it, do you have plans to get your design into the hands of someone who will make more like the guys over at retrousb.com?
Every one of my friends that has used the joystick with your board has said it's the best one they've ever used and I agree. Nerd tears will be shed if I'm forever the guy that has just one of your boards - the last one ever sold.
Regardless of what you decide to do, thank you for making this. Even just one truly great joystick is better than none and I'm grateful to have it :)
Quote from: micro on September 12, 2015, 09:42:11 AM
At the moment I don't plan on making another batch of the N64 Stick Converter PCB. Ordering the sticks is just a PITA. It's so much trouble to get these delivered without all pins bent.. Also I'd like to mention that during the last batch there was a considerable amount of people who contacted me to express their interest in the PCB, but then never responded nor paid. This kind of behaviour really pisses me off...
I will wait for it patiently, but, please make another batch. I have 6 controllers and intend to put on four of them.
Will be a honor helping you find new customers here in Brasil!
Here most of controllers sticks is damaged, and people left yours N64 because of this
same :)
I could be definitely interested for 10 of them. just let us know
I could be very happy to have this mod on my controllers.
After my official RGB mod, will just miss the wireless controller haha =-)
Quote from: micro on September 12, 2015, 09:42:11 AM
That's a very nice video, good job! :D
At the moment I don't plan on making another batch of the N64 Stick Converter PCB. Ordering the sticks is just a PITA. It's so much trouble to get these delivered without all pins bent.. Also I'd like to mention that during the last batch there was a considerable amount of people who contacted me to express their interest in the PCB, but then never responded nor paid. This kind of behaviour really pisses me off...
EDIT: Kickstarter or crowdfunding in general for the PCB won't happen either... But stay chilled. I don't plan on taking the source code/PCB layout to my grave. Once I'm certain I will never make another batch, I will release the files. But the question is if people would really benefit from that without having a source for the 60° joysticks outside of Germany... :/
Just out of curiosity, how much do you usually order at one time? I'm wondering if you could make a list of people who want to order some, and before getting them made, take payment from the list of people willing to buy some (and have a spillover list to allow those waiting to pick up for anyone who bails out on you)
or if one person were willing to order boards from you and be, perhaps a middle man of sorts for it?
So long as you were organized enough to keep every person/address, order quantity, etc. tracked in an excel spreadsheet along with whether or not they've paid, that could be a great service to the community. I voice that because sometimes people don't seem to know what they're getting themselves into with something like this. There are a lot of data points, a lot of back and forth communication with people, and it will take a lot of time. If you mess up in your data tracking or fail to communicate, people will be ticked.
...I know because I once cleaned up the mess of someone who was (poorly) organizing orders and order fulfillment in Word. WORD! It took me 3x as long to clean up the mess than if I'd just done it all myself from the start.
Interested to see what Micro thinks.
Quote from: Informationator on September 24, 2015, 12:00:17 AM
So long as you were organized enough to keep every person/address, order quantity, etc. tracked in an excel spreadsheet along with whether or not they've paid, that could be a great service to the community. I voice that because sometimes people don't seem to know what they're getting themselves into with something like this. There are a lot of data points, a lot of back and forth communication with people, and it will take a lot of time. If you mess up in your data tracking or fail to communicate, people will be ticked.
...I know because I once cleaned up the mess of someone who was (poorly) organizing orders and order fulfillment in Word. WORD! It took me 3x as long to clean up the mess than if I'd just done it all myself from the start.
Interested to see what Micro thinks.
Thats a good idea, id love to order a good lot of these for friends if possible. I'm glad i had the foresight to get 4 of them when the first v3 batch showed up. Its nice to have a set, but i would love to get some more, since they've been so good.
I've even been doing some Mario 64 speed running and using one, its been great to know i won't have to worry about them wearing out when throwing the joystick around to do moves and spin bowser around.
I'd almost like to get a large batch and try and get some of the junkier controllers fixed up with them to sell to people to be honest.
Quote from: dav3yb on September 24, 2015, 12:28:10 AM
I'd almost like to get a large batch and try and get some of the junkier controllers fixed up with them to sell to people to be honest.
Yeah, if you look at the red controller's joystick in the video I made above, you'll see its joystick is TERRIBLE. I ordered it out of Japan and expected it to be all worn out, but I'd have been really upset if I didn't expect it to be bad from the start. The mod took that controller from complete garbage to the best controller I have.
I still haven't tried installing the PCB's I ordered, I have a bunch of good controllers plus some Hori Mini's. I'll probably look into trying to do this soonish though.
When ordering a GameCube style stick, does it matter where you get it from? Are there multiple versions out there made by different people? I'm guessing it doesn't matter at all since we are replacing the internals.
Thanks.
Quote from: Traveller on October 03, 2015, 08:33:42 AM
I still haven't tried installing the PCB's I ordered, I have a bunch of good controllers plus some Hori Mini's. I'll probably look into trying to do this soonish though.
When ordering a GameCube style stick, does it matter where you get it from? Are there multiple versions out there made by different people? I'm guessing it doesn't matter at all since we are replacing the internals.
Thanks.
I ordered from the below link back in June and they worked perfectly for this mod. Mine had "V3" stamped on the bottom: http://m.ebay.com/itm/380952838594?_mwBanner=1
I want one as soon as you get them in.
I bought the gamecube stick for N64 controller and the stick is good but too sensitive, after some search i found this topic and i saw a lot of people recommending this PCB to fix the problem. I think i found this a bit too late but if you decide to sell another batch (i really hope you decide to make another batch :) ) i will definitely buy at least 2-3 PCB.
Man sure would be nice to get some of these for my n64. All my controllers have aftermarket joysticks, and it's very difficult for most people to use them. Came upon this thread and I thought my prayers were answered. Micro seems to be a genius, from what I've seen they work perfect. The only problem is he's not willing to sell them because of bent pins and people not willing to follow through. Sure is a shame. ALOT of people would love to have these if only more people were aware. Seems like a great business opportunity if you ask me. Anyone else aware of any similar fixes out there that are actually available to buy?
Quote from: Keek on October 19, 2015, 04:47:02 PM
Man sure would be nice to get some of these for my n64. All my controllers have aftermarket joysticks, and it's very difficult for most people to use them. Came upon this thread and I thought my prayers were answered. Micro seems to be a genius, from what I've seen they work perfect. The only problem is he's not willing to sell them because of bent pins and people not willing to follow through. Sure is a shame. ALOT of people would love to have these if only more people were aware. Seems like a great business opportunity if you ask me. Anyone else aware of any similar fixes out there that are actually available to buy?
I don't think there are any equivalents out there right now. I really wish the people selling the aftermarket joysticks would get their act together and fix the sensitivity.
Maybe Micro will do a special weihnachten shipment :P I do hope that we can get more made either through Micro or through a business partner in the next 6-12 months. A few of my controllers are looking pretty rough...
Yea I've been watching this thread for a few month, waiting for word on new ones. Like the rest of the people above me I'd definitely be interested in ordering some, probably order 12 if possible so I can give a set of 4 to my brothers as gifts and have 4 of my own.
Found out about this after a 'hard' day of searching for replacement sticks - can't wait for the new batch (haven't soldered since high school so this'll be a cool project). :)
Out of interest, has anyone got a video of a modded stick working with Goldeneye or Perfect Dark (using the 1.2 control style)? Will primarily be used for speedrunning these and the more precise the better.
Quote from: ogran on October 26, 2015, 05:54:57 PM
Found out about this after a 'hard' day of searching for replacement sticks - can't wait for the new batch (haven't soldered since high school so this'll be a cool project). :)
Out of interest, has anyone got a video of a modded stick working with Goldeneye or Perfect Dark (using the 1.2 control style)? Will primarily be used for speedrunning these and the more precise the better.
I posted a video that includes a small bit of Goldeneye footage farther up in the thread. I think these modded sticks are superior to the original design during normal use and I've done some basic speedrunning myself. You just need to ensure you utilize the extended range mode. Their edge range isn't perfect for Goldeneye, so even with extended range mode it's possible you could run into some issues, but throughout the rest of the range (99% of it), it feels fantastic.
I would be in for 4 if you get around to another batch! You can take my name and shame me if I don't purchase! :)
Edit: I would be up for pre-order if that helps.
Hey Ogran, it works nicely on speedruns since the v1.0. You may not know me, but I'm on The-Elite rankings aswell. I'm currentrly ranked at 29th on Goldeneye. Need to play again someday if I ever have time.
Quote from: Informationator on October 20, 2015, 12:18:29 AM
Quote from: Keek on October 19, 2015, 04:47:02 PM
Man sure would be nice to get some of these for my n64. All my controllers have aftermarket joysticks, and it's very difficult for most people to use them. Came upon this thread and I thought my prayers were answered. Micro seems to be a genius, from what I've seen they work perfect. The only problem is he's not willing to sell them because of bent pins and people not willing to follow through. Sure is a shame. ALOT of people would love to have these if only more people were aware. Seems like a great business opportunity if you ask me. Anyone else aware of any similar fixes out there that are actually available to buy?
I don't think there are any equivalents out there right now. I really wish the people selling the aftermarket joysticks would get their act together and fix the sensitivity.
Maybe Micro will do a special weihnachten shipment :P I do hope that we can get more made either through Micro or through a business partner in the next 6-12 months. A few of my controllers are looking pretty rough...
Informationator, are you my hype man? ;D
As I said I don't plan on making another batch atm. You might have read about yet another update of the GC-style replacement stick. I could swear that I've seen pics of the new version in this very thread but I can't find them. Maybe I was tripping...
It seems the new version also has this 38° joystick which means it still got a "dead border" on the outside and a high sensitivity. You could also see on the pics that the new PCB got a different shape. It's mounted with 2 screws instead of 4. I don't know if the N64 Stick Converter PCB v3 would fit this new case. And as long as I don't know for sure, there won't be another batch.
I can't imagine anyone likes to buy a PCB which doesn't fit. ;)
And for the love of god, please don't send me any more messages concerning the availability of these PCBs. As I said, currently there are none available. Just check this thread once a month and you probably won't miss the next batch.
Furthermore I'm not sure how Lawrence (=admin) feels about all the people that registerd on this board just to express their interest in something that isn't available... :/
I'm glad I got in to order the sticks. Thank you micro for your work. The current v3 works for me but I don't play much GoldenEye so. Perfect for everything else.
Hopefully you can find a better supplier. N64 stick replacements are needed and you did a great job with the v3 pcb in my opinion.
I don't see how Lawrence should have any issue with more people registering on this forum. Even if it may be initially just for your PCBs, some might stay for participating in other discussions as well. And I think that's actually a good thing.
Yeah I don't mind, worst case they take an amount of space in the database that's so close to zero it doesn't matter. And I can trim them out years later without penalty. So carry on! =)
Thanks for straightening this out, Lawrence. :)
EDIT: I ordered from the eBay seller and I have just finished doing the basic install, the soldering was a tiny bit messy at first, but it seems to have gone well. I have just checked it on using the test rom.
Up: 84
Down: -84
Left: -82
Right: 83
The un-modified one has number values in the 90's, but has that awful square shape obviously, whys that? I quickly tried the Hori Mini and it had higher numbers again if I recall, but it had the correct shape.
Loving it so far, feels good.
Can the calibration change over time? Is that why we'd want to redo it?
Thanks Micro.
Quote from: micro on October 31, 2015, 07:45:04 AM
Quote from: Informationator on October 20, 2015, 12:18:29 AM
Quote from: Keek on October 19, 2015, 04:47:02 PM
Man sure would be nice to get some of these for my n64. All my controllers have aftermarket joysticks, and it's very difficult for most people to use them. Came upon this thread and I thought my prayers were answered. Micro seems to be a genius, from what I've seen they work perfect. The only problem is he's not willing to sell them because of bent pins and people not willing to follow through. Sure is a shame. ALOT of people would love to have these if only more people were aware. Seems like a great business opportunity if you ask me. Anyone else aware of any similar fixes out there that are actually available to buy?
I don't think there are any equivalents out there right now. I really wish the people selling the aftermarket joysticks would get their act together and fix the sensitivity.
Maybe Micro will do a special weihnachten shipment :P I do hope that we can get more made either through Micro or through a business partner in the next 6-12 months. A few of my controllers are looking pretty rough...
Informationator, are you my hype man? ;D
Haha, just a hopeful nerd who checks this thread a lot so I don't miss the next batch if you ever have a change of heart. Since I'm around anyway I've tried to contribute where I can. I am hyped about your product! Many of my friends have asked me to notify them if you ever make more, because they love the feel of the one controller I put it in.
Thanks, Lawrence, for including us :)
Hey Guys, i want to replace the Rubberstick of those GC-Styled-Replacementstricks. I have tried the Xbox 360/Xbox One-Sticks wich have a way to big gap, Wii u Smashbros Controller ist to deep, and some more...)
I´d love some Sticks with better grip or different color but i couldn´t find any so far.
Does anyone of you know where to get those Sticks? (no matter if it´s already in any existing controller or single purchase)
Copied from the first post:
QuoteAnnouncement: I'm planning on making another batch of the N64 Stick Converter PCB v3. :D The PCB sets should be ready by end of january/early february. Instructions for ordering the PCB's sets can be found in this very post once they're ready. So be patient and check this thread once in a while. ^_^
I already ordered most of the parts. Let's hope the damn analog sticks will arrive without bent pins this time... ;)
Quote from: micro on December 30, 2015, 04:46:24 AM
Copied from the first post:
QuoteAnnouncement: I'm planning on making another batch of the N64 Stick Converter PCB v3. :D The PCB sets should be ready by end of january/early february. Instructions for ordering the PCB's sets can be found in this very post once they're ready. So be patient and check this thread once in a while. ^_^
I already ordered most of the parts. Let's hope the damn analog sticks will arrive without bent pins this time... ;)
GLORY IS UPON US. THE TIME FOR POWERSLIDING IS NIGH! JOHNSONS AND JOHNSONS NO MORE TEARS
Great news looking forward to ordering the kit.
Good news indeed. :)
What is the price of one gonna be (roughly)?
So is there potentially some issues with a "newer" GC Style joystick? I know there was some mention of this before, but didn't know for sure. And if i can manage, ill be in for at least 8 of these new ones. I've loved the ones i've been using, and will be hooking some friends up with some for sure. Considering ordering 12 tbh.
Also, about how many do you actually get in a "batch"?
(http://i.imgur.com/DYryk42.jpg)
Ok guys, the PCB's are already ready! ;D
See 1st post for infos on how to order.
@dav3yb: I can't guarantee that the N64 Stick Converter PCB v3 is compatible with those new GC-style sticks.
sent my order in.
ive also ordered 4 gc replacement sticks from what i think was the same place i ordered them from before, and im hoping they haven't changed at all.
Are there any pictures of the "new" replacement ones? I haven't been able to really find any information on anything other that what ive read here so far.
Quote from: dav3yb on January 15, 2016, 02:16:46 AM
sent my order in.
ive also ordered 4 gc replacement sticks from what i think was the same place i ordered them from before, and im hoping they haven't changed at all.
Are there any pictures of the "new" replacement ones? I haven't been able to really find any information on anything other that what ive read here so far.
Please post any pics/info you discover on those, dav3yb. Would be interested to know any differences/advantages/disadvantages of going with those, though I'm pretty satisfied with my N64 style ones.
I also put in an order about an hour and a half ago. Pumped :) I'll finally be able to convert my remaining three controllers' joysticks.
Quote from: Informationator on January 15, 2016, 02:20:37 AM
Quote from: dav3yb on January 15, 2016, 02:16:46 AM
sent my order in.
ive also ordered 4 gc replacement sticks from what i think was the same place i ordered them from before, and im hoping they haven't changed at all.
Are there any pictures of the "new" replacement ones? I haven't been able to really find any information on anything other that what ive read here so far.
Please post any pics/info you discover on those, dav3yb. Would be interested to know any differences/advantages/disadvantages of going with those, though I'm pretty satisfied with my N64 style ones.
I also put in an order about an hour and a half ago. Pumped :) I'll finally be able to convert my remaining three controllers' joysticks.
will do! They're from an ebay seller called video game museum, and im pretty sure thats where i ordered mine from before. i should get them next week and ill be able to tell pretty soon if they're any different or newer.
Thanks! I ordered my V3 joystick boxes (not related to this V3 circuit board - has V3 printed on the plastic) from video-game-museum in May of last year. Is THIS (http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-REPLACEMENT-Joystick-for-Nintendo-64-Controller-Repair-N64-Thumbstick-Pad-/380952838594?hash=item58b28f01c2:m:me1qPWKB3Fch2kDSzmM6uWg) what you ordered? ...because it looks identical to what I bought last May.
Quote from: Informationator on January 15, 2016, 04:31:04 AM
Thanks! I ordered my V3 joystick boxes (not related to this V3 circuit board - has V3 printed on the plastic) from video-game-museum in May of last year. Is THIS (http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-REPLACEMENT-Joystick-for-Nintendo-64-Controller-Repair-N64-Thumbstick-Pad-/380952838594?hash=item58b28f01c2:m:me1qPWKB3Fch2kDSzmM6uWg) what you ordered? ...because it looks identical to what I bought last May.
Yep, those are the exact ones i ordered today, and i think they're the same ones i ordered last time as well.
I just asked video-game-museum which version they are currently selling and they responded with "2015". Not sure if that means anything to you users that have ordered units from them in the past.
Would it be possible to use the stick case from an original controller to fix the restrictor gate problem?. That means that you would have to cut it to fit the gc stick, but I was wondering if anyone has already tried this.
I could have sworn I saw pics of the new GC-style stick in this very thread some months ago.
Anyways, takeshi posted some pics on assemblergames: http://assemblergames.com/l/threads/n64-controller-solutions.58300/#post-838723
It looks like the N64 Stick Converter PCB v3 COULD still fit... Well, eventually we will know for sure. ;D
The analog stick itself looks like it's a different brand. The "388" marking could mean that they're still using +-38°-joysticks. That would mean even this version would suffer from the "dead border" on the outside.
Just registered to show my support of this project. Placed an order for 1 PCB set too. This is the kind of stuff we need to keep old school gaming alive :)
Quote from: AndehX on January 15, 2016, 11:25:18 PM
Just registered to show my support of this project. Placed an order for 1 PCB set too. This is the kind of stuff we need to keep old school gaming alive :)
Agreed. At this point, the ONLY thing I wish was different at this point is the restriction gate. If we could just get someone with a little 3D printing know-how to print one that matches the dimensions of the N64 version, you could just swap out the top half of the aftermarket joystick boxes with the 3D printed one and it'd match an N64's sensitivity perfectly without any need for extended range mode.
Still, as far as problems go, that one is minimal, and even if we never had that, these circuit boards and potentiometers are better than brand new joysticks of the original design in my opinion.
This is somewhat offtopic but can anyone point me to documentation on how the stick pcb talks to the main pcb of the pad? (Edit: Oh, and does anybody know whether third party controllers usually use the same protocol? I mean, they could probably just run lines from the potentiometers (or whatever they are using) to the main pcb and have all processing happen in a single chip...)
And micro, could you explain what happens in extended range mode; do you scale the x & y values down by a constant factor? (or, if this info is out there somewhere a link would be just as nice :) )
Edit: After reading through the PCB v3 pdf I guess that is what you are doing, but I am not 100% certain. It says "But keep in mind while using the extended range mode the stick will be slightly more sensitive." So is there a small region at the left-, right-, top- and bottom-most positions where the output values do not change anymore, i.e. you reach the maximum/minimum x/y values before the stick touches the restrictor?
Well, i have my PCB's ordered but no gc style analog sticks yet. Anybody happen to know a seller with the older version on sale? Or should I just wait till somebody gets to test whether the PCB's work with the newest version?
Quote from: micro on January 15, 2016, 12:25:16 AM
I can't guarantee that the N64 Stick Converter PCB v3 is compatible with those new GC-style sticks.
I have one of the new GC-style sticks with the rubber topped analog stick. The base still has the four screw holes in the same position as used on micro's PCB, but one screw hole support is slightly recessed, and there are no screws actually holding the new PCB in place :-\ Will try and add a picture later.
<EDIT>This post has pictures of the new version:-
http://s9.zetaboards.com/Nintendo_64_Forever/single/?p=8187124&t=7453280
(http://i.imgur.com/9HvNVGkl.jpg)
Does anyone happen to have a picture of the inside of the bottom half of the old GC-style stick? Hoping to compare it to the new version to see if anything has changed which might affect the fitment of micro's board.
Quote from: J-O-A on January 17, 2016, 03:20:32 AM
Well, i have my PCB's ordered but no gc style analog sticks yet. Anybody happen to know a seller with the older version on sale? Or should I just wait till somebody gets to test whether the PCB's work with the newest version?
I recently bought some from "Classic Game Source Inc." on amazon.com. I did not see any difference to the one in micro's manual, four screws etc. But that's no guarantee, you never know :(
But where can I get one of the new gc style ones? And is the rubber top preferable to plastic?
How many versions are there?
- SimpleJet (V3 on back? like the ones in micro's pdf?)
- Hyperkin (one screw on back?)
?
This is what I have: Images (http://postimg.org/image/4qdkx1k59/)
I just saw it says "SIMPLE JET V2.0" on the PCB. But it has "V3" on the housing. I have others (from the same order) which do not have the "2015" sticker, but they seem to be same otherwise. So I guess they are "old style"?
@Link83: Is the recessed hole the top left one? Looks like they have compatible PCBs.
Quote from: Fuddman on January 17, 2016, 05:54:08 AM
@Link83: Is the recessed hole the top left one? Looks like they have compatible PCBs.
Yes the top left screw hole support is lower than the other three, it looks like all four supports are the same height in your picture?
...Still, even three screw holes *should* give enough support, assuming I can find some suitable screws to secure the PCB in place.
If you dont mind me asking how long ago did you order from "Classic Game Source Inc."?
Quote from: Link83 on January 17, 2016, 06:08:08 AM
it looks like all four supports are the same height in your picture?
I think so, yes.
Quote from: Link83 on January 17, 2016, 06:08:08 AM
If you dont mind me asking how long ago did you order from "Classic Game Source Inc."?
Not at all. :) Ordered Dec 31, shipped Jan 4.
Also note, they have 2 different products: "N64 Replacement Joystick GameCube Style, High Sensitivity" and "Redesigned REPLACEMENT Joystick for Nintendo 64 Controller Repair N64 Thumbstick Pad", I ordered both but I can't tell which are which, they might just be the same.
I'll let you know whether micro's PCBs fit when I get them, I think they will.
Thanks, yeah I am certain yours are the older version - especially if your PCB was held in place with screws.
In case it helps anyone I purchased my newer version from ebay seller "whatsapp2012" in December 2015.
Quote from: Link83 on January 17, 2016, 06:28:10 AM
In case it helps anyone I purchased my newer version from ebay seller "whatsapp2012" in December 2015.
Thank you, found the seller!
They all use the same image with the brown box, seems you can't go by that. >:(
Quote from: Link83 on January 17, 2016, 06:28:10 AM
In case it helps anyone I purchased my newer version from ebay seller "whatsapp2012" in December 2015.
Very interesting. I bought one from that seller too. Looks like I'll probably be getting a newer version too.
As for that top left post being smaller, you could just fill the space with a couple of small washers and then maybe use a longer screw.
Quote from: micro on January 15, 2016, 12:25:16 AM
(http://i.imgur.com/DYryk42.jpg)
Are the six points to the right of the "PCB v3" line for an AVR ISP connector? If so
- is the pinout
top: GND, MOSI, +VCC
bottom: RESET, SCK, MISO ? - is there enough space for a connector or do you use pogo pins?
Quote from: micro on January 15, 2016, 12:25:16 AMOk guys, the PCB's are already ready!
See 1st post for infos on how to order.
Hi, sent you an email on Sunday to order 2 PCBs - this is a great project and I can't wait to rejuvenate my controllers. Haven't heard back from you though :(
@Fuddman: I'm not involved in any way on the project, but it's obvioulsy an ISP connector. The pinout must be standard.
Just curious, what's the point of this question? Are you working on your own version or want to downgrade the FW? You can just solder an ISP connector, burn the FW and just remove it, as you probably never need it anymore unless you're debugging your own firmware. ;)
Quote from: public-pervert on January 20, 2016, 12:23:47 AM
@Fuddman: I'm not involved in any way on the project, but it's obvioulsy an ISP connector. The pinout must be standard.
Just curious, what's the point of this question? Are you working on your own version or want to downgrade the FW? You can just solder an ISP connector, burn the FW and just remove it, as you probably never need it anymore unless you're debugging your own firmware. ;)
Well, I was pretty sure it is an ISP connector, but who knows? And which way would it have to be? I guess you can go by the marked pin (bottom left on the lower PCB), but I wanted to ask just to make sure.
I can't be working on anything right now because I don't have any PCBs ;), but I might want to experiment with it a little some time. After all you would need to reflash it even if you just want to change some constants, right?
Yeah I thought about just soldering it on and if it prevents the casing from closing to desolder it again, but I would rather not attach/detach it that often...
btw, as you mentioned downgrading, are the new pcbs compatible with the old software? (I know it is floating around somewhere, there is a link in another thread)
Quote from: Link83 on January 17, 2016, 04:30:30 AM
Quote from: micro on January 15, 2016, 12:25:16 AM
I can't guarantee that the N64 Stick Converter PCB v3 is compatible with those new GC-style sticks.
I have one of the new GC-style sticks with the rubber topped analog stick. The base still has the four screw holes in the same position as used on micro's PCB, but one screw hole support is slightly recessed, and there are no screws actually holding the new PCB in place :-\ Will try and add a picture later.
<EDIT>This post has pictures of the new version:-
http://s9.zetaboards.com/Nintendo_64_Forever/single/?p=8187124&t=7453280
(http://i.imgur.com/9HvNVGkl.jpg)
Does anyone happen to have a picture of the inside of the bottom half of the old GC-style stick? Hoping to compare it to the new version to see if anything has changed which might affect the fitment of micro's board.
Here's one of the earlier N64, GC-style, sticks.
(http://i.imgur.com/mDMCiuJ.jpg?1)
That's alright. It's just a matter of finding some slightly wider screws, then it should be fine.
@Fuddman: AFAIK, Micro doesn't changed the microcontroller, so even if he changed the pinouts, it could be compatible with little modifications.
@AndehX: BTW, are you David Clemens?
Quote from: public-pervert on January 20, 2016, 03:44:16 AM
@AndehX: BTW, are you David Clemens?
errr.... No? Why do you ask? lol
Quote from: public-pervert on January 20, 2016, 03:44:16 AM
@Fuddman: AFAIK, Micro doesn't changed the microcontroller, so even if he changed the pinouts, it could be compatible with little modifications.
You're right, it should be fine. Or maybe he'll release the code for the new one anyway. :)
Well some good news on my front! The GC sticks I picked up from Video Game Museum on ebay seem to still use the older design. They're marked with the V3 and a 2015 sticker, but the one i opened up looked pretty much exactly like the old style, even down the 4 small screws holding the board in place (and they do line up with micro's pcb, i tested out with my original v3).
I went ahead and ordered myself 4 more, so hopefully it's not a case of just "old stock with new markings" for some reason.
Oh, and joystick cap is still plastic, not rubber.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/380952838594?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
here's a link to the exact auction.
Quote from: AndehX on January 20, 2016, 03:48:13 AM
Quote from: public-pervert on January 20, 2016, 03:44:16 AM
@AndehX: BTW, are you David Clemens?
errr.... No? Why do you ask? lol
Because you're using the same avatar as David Clemens from the-elite.net
And since speedrunnig brought me into modding scene, I thought you could be him :)
Quote from: public-pervert on January 20, 2016, 08:55:25 PM
Quote from: AndehX on January 20, 2016, 03:48:13 AM
Quote from: public-pervert on January 20, 2016, 03:44:16 AM
@AndehX: BTW, are you David Clemens?
errr.... No? Why do you ask? lol
Because you're using the same avatar as David Clemens from the-elite.net
And since speedrunnig brought me into modding scene, I thought you could be him :)
oooh right, no, i'm not him, although I am into speedrunning and modding too :P
Cool another run, I'll let some ppl know.
We still order through the email in the first post?
Thanks.
My sticks came today (very quick!) I was kinda worried that I would butcher them when soldering, but I think they turned out ok (im no soldering expert)
Not sure if the discoloration is burn marks from my iron (its got a chisel tip) or flux from the solder....
Don't have the GC stick yet (still waiting for delivery from japan) but as soon as it comes, I should be ready to go :D
Quote from: AndehX on January 21, 2016, 11:01:16 PM
My sticks came today (very quick!) I was kinda worried that I would butcher them when soldering, but I think they turned out ok (im no soldering expert)
Not sure if the discoloration is burn marks from my iron (its got a chisel tip) or flux from the solder....
Don't have the GC stick yet (still waiting for delivery from japan) but as soon as it comes, I should be ready to go :D
looks like just some flux to me. a cotton swab and a dab of alcohol will clean it up, which you might want to do, since i think some fluxes can be mildly corrosive.
So I got my GC stick from japan today, and I can confirm that Micro's PCB is fully compatible with the new GC design. It doesn't even need to be screwed in.
Great post, thanks for letting us know! :D
But I also like to say that I'm not happy about the hype that has been built up around these PCB's. Not at all...
In my opinion you should get the GC-style stick first and see for yourself if you're satisfied. If not, you can get the N64 Stick Converter PCB to improve it. But to me it seems most people do it the other way round. :/
Anyways, I also want to announce that I only got a few PCB's in stock. Don't worry, I plan on making more, but unfortunately one part (the switch) is out of stock. There is no any other supplier but mouser. It seems I have to wait until March for the switches to arrive.
Quote from: micro on January 26, 2016, 02:33:54 AM
In my opinion you should get the GC-style stick first and see for yourself if you're satisfied. If not, you can get the N64 Stick Converter PCB to improve it. But to me it seems most people do it the other way round. :/
I understand what you mean, but I know that if I bought the stick first, knowing about the flaws with it, I would notice them right away, and would instantly want to order your PCB anyway. Im a bit OCD about stuff like this, and knowing that there is a better solution than the the GC stick, I wouldn't be able to rest knowing I'm not getting the best out of it.
I have a question.
I have one of those cheap knockoff N64 controllers. How would I wire your PCB to it? (It only seems to have 4 points for X and Y)
@AndehX
Do you know how the stick that came with your controller works? It might be that it works differently than the ones in an original Nintendo controller -> "talks another language" -> no easy way to wire micro's PCB to it. :(
Apart from guessing and being lucky you would probably have to analyze each brand and come up with a solution for that.
btw, what brand is it?
It doesn't have a brand, its just a cheap knockoff controller that came with my Japanese N64 I bought off Ebay. The analog that was on it was absolutely garbage.
After looking closely at the traces, the 4 pins seem to be GND,X,GND,Y Which i'm guessing just leaves 3.3v which I could wire up easily. Thing is, I don't know what the 6 pins on Micro's PCB are as they are simply labled 1,2,3,4,5,6
Well, I fear it won't just work like that.
You could try looking at the pinout of the AVR, find ground and test which pin is connected to that, etc. but it's probably easier to wait till micro tells you the pinout. :)
Micro's PCB has to have the same pinout as the original Nintendo one (correct?) so you could also look at that. I didn't find that much documentation on the workings of the N64 controller, is that info available somewhere? Things like how the small PCB in the stick communicates with the bigger PCB in the controller.
yeah I tried looking around for the pinout of the analog in the official N64 controller but couldn't find anything.
Quote from: AndehX on January 26, 2016, 12:15:55 AM
So I got my GC stick from japan today, and I can confirm that Micro's PCB is fully compatible with the new GC design. It doesn't even need to be screwed in.
You beat me to it! I just received an 'old' GC-style stick from "Classic Game Source Inc." (Thanks Fuddman) and micro's N64 Stick Converter PCB v3, and just took some photos to post in the thread...Well, I guess I may as well post the pics anyway! :P
Until now I was not able to compare the old and new versions, but now that I can I have made some observations:-
Old Version-PCB labelled "SIMPLE JET V2.0 C"
-Case is glued shut and is missing the screw post in the top half of the shell, so it can only be closed shut with glue
-PCB is held in place with four small black screws
-The two plastic side posts do not protrude high enough to secure the PCB in place.
-Stick is made of solid plastic with a small hole in the centre.
New Version-PCB labelled "N64-3D-A05"
-Case is held together with one screw, screw post has been 'restored' to the top half of the shell.
-Instead of screws the PCB is held in place by plastic posts; two side posts prevent sideways movement, the old screw posts prevent downward movement, and the top half of the case now has four extra plastic posts which prevent upwards movement, effectively 'sandwiching' the PCB in place.
-The old PCB and micro's PCB are both slightly thicker than the new PCB (The new one is a really cheap/shoddily soldered single sided PCB) which means that there is a tiny gap when initially closing the two halfs of the shell. Inserting the screw applies a small amount of pressure which is enough to remove the gap, or I guess you could also shave/sand off a tiny amount of the four top posts.
-The screw posts in the bottom half of the case are considerably larger then the old versions, and the old versions screws are too small to be used in them.
-Stick now has a rubberised top, however it is a hard/smooth type of rubber so it doesnt add much additional grip. The stick also has a thicker base post on the bottom, which should give it additional strength over the old version.
Old and New GC-Style N64 Analog Sticks Parts Comparison(http://i.imgur.com/AYJ8VKXm.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/AYJ8VKX.jpg)(http://i.imgur.com/Sa8cqDam.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/Sa8cqDa.jpg)
Old and New GC-Style PCB's and Sticks(http://i.imgur.com/8fV9Tr4m.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/8fV9Tr4.jpg)(http://i.imgur.com/XsmIci2m.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/XsmIci2.jpg)(http://i.imgur.com/nrNZ0pcm.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/nrNZ0pc.jpg)
micro's PCB in New GC style casing (Note the plastic securing posts)
(http://i.imgur.com/K472tiim.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/K472tii.jpg)(http://i.imgur.com/TBfYOWom.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/TBfYOWo.jpg)(http://i.imgur.com/7UkhKAKm.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/7UkhKAK.jpg)
Quote from: micro on January 26, 2016, 02:33:54 AM
But I also like to say that I'm not happy about the hype that has been built up around these PCB's. Not at all...
In my opinion you should get the GC-style stick first and see for yourself if you're satisfied. If not, you can get the N64 Stick Converter PCB to improve it. But to me it seems most people do it the other way round. :/
Sorry to hear that micro :-\
I am guessing someone has complained? In which case they only have themselves to blame - if someone cant understand the benefits of your PCB (60° analog stick instead of 38°, Calibration mode, Extended range mode) they shouldn't have ordered it! Hope you dont take it to heart.
Thanks, Link83, very useful pics!
Is it possible to swap the stick (plastic part with rubber on new style) between them?
Seems the new style is not an improvement over old style(..?) My new style one hasn't arrived yet.
The restrictor is still the same shape and size though, isn't it? Why couldn't they just fix that with the new revision... :-[
Some people say the best option is still a new original stick (yeah, if only there was an unlimited supply of those..) but afaik all new consoles now do use potentiometer sticks, so is there any downside to those? (I mean, right now the only thing we seem to be missing are correctly shaped restrictor gates. And I don't remember feeling that every non-N64 controller was somehow less precise. GC controllers with digital shoulder buttons and a proper Z button would rock (for N64 games).)
I agree the restrictor gate could do with being maybe 1mm smaller in diameter as its just slightly too big for the stick. If I push hard enough, I can get the stick to hit the restrictor gate, but with normal use, the stick stops less than 1mm away from it.
Quote from: AndehX on January 27, 2016, 01:45:25 AM
I agree the restrictor gate could do with being maybe 1mm smaller in diameter as its just slightly too big for the stick. If I push hard enough, I can get the stick to hit the restrictor gate, but with normal use, the stick stops less than 1mm away from it.
Are you talking about the 38° or 60° one?
Quote from: Fuddman on January 27, 2016, 01:33:28 AM
Thanks, Link83, very useful pics!
Is it possible to swap the stick (plastic part with rubber on new style) between them?
Seems the new style is not an improvement over old style(..?) My new style one hasn't arrived yet.
Yes its possible to swap the sticks :)
Its hard to say if its an improvement or not :-\ I like that the new version doesnt use glue and can be opened and closed with just a single screw (Cutting the old one open was a pain) However I like that the old version has the PCB screwed in place, rather than just held in place by plastic poles (Screws just seem 'sturdier' to me, but perhaps i'm being biased!) If I can find some screws the exact right size for the new version, I guess that would resolve the issue.
In regards to the two types of stick, the rubber is nice but I dont feel that it adds a whole lot (Its hard and smooth, not soft and grippy like modern analog sticks) I do like the sturdier base post though.
I guess if I had to pic between the two types, I would probably pick the new version since its not glued shut.
Quote from: Fuddman on January 27, 2016, 01:33:28 AM
The restrictor is still the same shape and size though, isn't it? Why couldn't they just fix that with the new revision... :-[
I know! It was the one thing I kept thinking about when examining the two. Considering they were redesigning the case anyway, its a real shame they didnt fix the restrictors size/shape. My only guess is that they wanted to keep using the 38° analog sticks, and so adjusting the restrictor size/shape would affect that.
If they had just switched to using 60° analog sticks, and changed the restrictor to be the same size/shape as the original N64's, then it would be almost perfect!
Personally I am going to dremel out an original N64 stick case so I have the correct restrictor size and shape. I see people have done this before using a Lodgenet Stick:-
http://s9.zetaboards.com/Nintendo_64_Forever/single/?p=8120863&t=7389142
http://s9.zetaboards.com/Nintendo_64_Forever/single/?p=8170660&t=7389142
(http://i.imgur.com/4kD9n2vm.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/4kD9n2v.jpg)(http://i.imgur.com/CYFRfwym.png) (http://i.imgur.com/CYFRfwy.png)
Quote from: Fuddman on January 27, 2016, 02:02:36 AM
Quote from: AndehX on January 27, 2016, 01:45:25 AM
I agree the restrictor gate could do with being maybe 1mm smaller in diameter as its just slightly too big for the stick. If I push hard enough, I can get the stick to hit the restrictor gate, but with normal use, the stick stops less than 1mm away from it.
Are you talking about the 38° or 60° one?
the new 60 degree stick
Quote from: AndehX on January 27, 2016, 02:13:47 AM
Quote from: Fuddman on January 27, 2016, 02:02:36 AM
Quote from: AndehX on January 27, 2016, 01:45:25 AM
I agree the restrictor gate could do with being maybe 1mm smaller in diameter as its just slightly too big for the stick. If I push hard enough, I can get the stick to hit the restrictor gate, but with normal use, the stick stops less than 1mm away from it.
Are you talking about the 38° or 60° one?
the new 60 degree stick
Are you sure you calibrated it correctly when you first turned it on?
Quote from: Link83 on January 27, 2016, 02:08:05 AM
Personally I am going to dremel out an original N64 stick case so I have the correct restrictor size and shape. I see people have done this before
Tried this myself. Doesn't work. The neck on the analog stick is too thin and the gate is just too wide for the stick to reach the edges. If you use a PS2 analog or an original GC analog, the neck is too thick and the stick wont have enough movement.
Quote from: Link83 on January 27, 2016, 02:16:55 AM
Are you sure you calibrated it correctly when you first turned it on?
no no, im talking about the physical size of the restrictor. Nothing to do with calibration. The stick physically wont move far enough to hit the restrictor gate. The gate needs to be 1mm smaller in diameter, or the neck on the analog needs to be 1mm thicker.
Strange, so we could need a smaller gate? I thought it was just too small in the upper/lower-right/left corners.
Or are there >60° sticks? ;)
Any idea where I could get a Lodgenet controller? :D
Dont worry, i'll make it work somehow! ;D
Quote from: Fuddman on January 27, 2016, 02:27:01 AM
Strange, so we could need a smaller gate? I thought it was just too small in the upper/lower-right/left corners.
Or are there >60° sticks? ;)
Any idea where I could get a Lodgenet controller? :D
The gate on the current GC sticks is ever so slightly too big for the stick to touch, so yeah, we either need slightly smaller gates on these, or slightly thicker necks on the stick.
So does the original N64 stick have more range than most others?!
It seems 60 degrees is the most you can get so I guess Nintendo, Sony and Microsoft are limited to those as well (otherwise there would at least be some chinese knockoff ;)).
I never knew the N64 stick was such a special beast!
I would imagine simply based on the fact that the N64 stick is not potentiometer based, that it probably does have more range.
Well, it seems that way. But why did they decide that all of a sudden 60 degrees was good enough?! :'( ;)
But is that what's causing aiming in Zelda and other things being best on an N64? Is it just that there is more range to the N64 stick or is there some bad calibration and/or programming involved...?
I have to find some time to mod one of my n64 sticks...
Has anyone tried one of the new stick revisions by itself (without micro's PCB)? The poster on assemblergames.com didn't notice any dead zones when he tested it, although he never tried OOT.
Quote from: libwilliam on January 27, 2016, 05:28:34 AM
Has anyone tried one of the new stick revisions by itself (without micro's PCB)? The poster on assemblergames.com didn't notice any dead zones when he tested it, although he never tried OOT.
I'll probably test out one of my new ones soon, but i remember the last batch i got was OK at best. OOT worked ok, and you could do spin attacks pretty easily, but overall they were just too sensitive. i expect the same from these tbh, but if i can think to do it when i get my boards together and ready to install ill put one through the test rom and see what it looks like.
Received my new PCBs today.. work like a dream. By far better than the original GC style, and I prefer them to the original (now that they have the proper sensitivity) Thanks Micro!!
Hey guy´s asked an question before with no response, so i try again. Does anyone of you know any replacement stick for these boards? I don´t like this hard plastic at all and i was just tried switch the stick with Xbox-, Xbox 360-, Playstation 4-, Original Gamecube-, Wii u controller- Sticks.
So far i didn´t find any fitting Stick... Anyone got an idea?
Quote from: Crosz_ on January 30, 2016, 02:10:00 AM
Hey guy´s asked an question before with no response, so i try again. Does anyone of you know any replacement stick for these boards? I don´t like this hard plastic at all and i was just tried switch the stick with Xbox-, Xbox 360-, Playstation 4-, Original Gamecube-, Wii u controller- Sticks.
So far i didn´t find any fitting Stick... Anyone got an idea?
Outside of some of the new versions coming with a more rubberized stick, i don't know of anything. you might be able to find something to glue to the top of the plastic ones to make it a bit more soft, but other than that i wouldn't be too sure.
Have you looked into rubber caps for joysticks? There are some on ebay, maybe they would fit. Very cheap, wonder what the quality is like...
Other than that, what's not fitting about them? Is it the shaft or can't you close the housing? Maybe you could modify one, but I can see that getting messy :(
Most of the time its the shaft wich is to big to fit for the joystick. Sometimes the height of the shaft is too smal so it doesn´t fit into the housing.
I´v tried to glue an xbox 360 stick onto the Analogstick with liquid plastic but it turned out quite bad.
Hmm i guess i´ll try the rubber caps... but i can´t find any rubber caps for the n 64 and as far as i see every other strick as an wider head so the caps won´t fit
Is the head of the newer version wider? i´m not sure if i see it on the picture above.
If I hold them side by side the new one does in fact look slightly larger, but it's almost nothing, barely noticeable, so the same caps should fit the old and new gc style sticks as well as an original N64 stick. Sorry, didn't know they were PS and Xbox mostly/only :(
Won't somebody just redesign and produce the whole stick + housing? :D
How about liquid rubber? Seems you can use it for putting grips on tools, so maybe a very thin one would work. you could even slightly modify the shape of the stick and hide the mess under the rubber coating ;)
I recently bought this for my dishwasher:
http://www.amazon.com/Rerack-Dishwasher-Rack-Repair-630076/dp/B00I9SK73K
Is probably more durable than normal liquid rubber. Just a thought in case anyone wanted to give it a shot. I like the hard plastic as-is since it's more true to the way the original N64 joysticks were, so I don't want to try it on mine, but it's not a terribly expensive product.
Quote from: libwilliam on January 27, 2016, 05:28:34 AM
Has anyone tried one of the new stick revisions by itself (without micro's PCB)? The poster on assemblergames.com didn't notice any dead zones when he tested it, although he never tried OOT.
Yep, search through the thread for a video I posted reviewing Micro's mod compared to original joysticks and 38 degree sticks. Unmodified aftermarket sticks (38 degree) are oversensitive for sure. They're better than really worn out originals in my opinion, but they're still "wrong" and will not be the same experience as either a new N64 joystick or a modified one with Micro's hardware in it.
By the way, I got my order of 5 items in the mail. Love the white PCBs. I have a friend who's hankerin' for some restored controllers, so hopefully he can get in on the March lot. Thanks again, Micro!
I would also like to be put on the list for FOUR for the march'16 shipment if still anticipated. Amazing work going on here kids micro and forum for all the feedback.
Malcolm
I was wondering if it's possible to reproduce micro's pcb here in Brazil. Importing from him became way too expensive, 1 euro is equivalent to 4.50 real nowadays. So, 17€ is R$75, almost a good quality used controller. :-\
Quote from: Chaps92 on February 18, 2016, 04:11:36 AM
I was wondering if it's possible to reproduce micro's pcb here in Brazil. Importing from him became way too expensive, 1 euro is equivalent to 4.50 real nowadays. So, 17€ is R$75, almost a good quality used controller. :-\
He'd have to release his specs and he won't do that until he's done selling them for good (understandable, since he spent a lot of time designing the board). Even if you could produce them in Brazil, I can tell you it'd cost you a lot more than buying from Micro, because you'd either have to order them in bulk, or you'd have to pay a premium for a custom order of just a few boards. The nice thing about Micro's solution is that it should be more durable than a standard joystick, so it might cost close to the same, but it's a much higher quality solution.
@Chaps92: I'm from Brazil aswell. It's really insanely expensive (at least for us). There's no way to buy it, unfortunately.
You can make your own boards though. Micro released the files of his previous versions, so it's very possible.
I work with CAD and have a CNC machine, but don't have one of those chinese replacement sticks. If you're interested, send me one board and I'll copy it's exactly format. Programming the AVR and put electronics is cake (thanks Micro!). I think I have some spare ATTINY24 somewhere as well as the programmer.
Has anybody had any experience with these vs Gamecube Style?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Nintendo-N64-Ersatz-Analogstick-Thumbstick-Joystick-Replacement-Hyperkin-/391393811042?hash=item5b20e39a62:g:WYMAAOSwnLdWqiW4 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Nintendo-N64-Ersatz-Analogstick-Thumbstick-Joystick-Replacement-Hyperkin-/391393811042?hash=item5b20e39a62:g:WYMAAOSwnLdWqiW4)
I really do hate to be bothersome, but being as it is halfway through March, are these available yet? I would hate to miss out again, I have 4 N64 controllers with GameCube style sticks that could really use the upgrade.
Quote from: John Dwaynsen on March 02, 2016, 02:24:33 AM
Has anybody had any experience with these vs Gamecube Style?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Nintendo-N64-Ersatz-Analogstick-Thumbstick-Joystick-Replacement-Hyperkin-/391393811042?hash=item5b20e39a62:g:WYMAAOSwnLdWqiW4 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Nintendo-N64-Ersatz-Analogstick-Thumbstick-Joystick-Replacement-Hyperkin-/391393811042?hash=item5b20e39a62:g:WYMAAOSwnLdWqiW4)
I decided to try those out once, and for the most part they were pretty bad. They use a similar design to the original sticks, but when i tested one out, it had massive dead zones in a couple directions, and wasn't really at all feeling like an original.
Quote from: dav3yb on March 16, 2016, 01:50:59 PM
Quote from: John Dwaynsen on March 02, 2016, 02:24:33 AM
Has anybody had any experience with these vs Gamecube Style?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Nintendo-N64-Ersatz-Analogstick-Thumbstick-Joystick-Replacement-Hyperkin-/391393811042?hash=item5b20e39a62:g:WYMAAOSwnLdWqiW4 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Nintendo-N64-Ersatz-Analogstick-Thumbstick-Joystick-Replacement-Hyperkin-/391393811042?hash=item5b20e39a62:g:WYMAAOSwnLdWqiW4)
I decided to try those out once, and for the most part they were pretty bad. They use a similar design to the original sticks, but when i tested one out, it had massive dead zones in a couple directions, and wasn't really at all feeling like an original.
Same here. I joined this forum after lurking for several months waiting for these to be back in stock. I bought those same exact "replacement" thumb-sticks for all my old/losing response N64 controllers and threw my old original ones out after swapping them. I ruined all of my controllers...playing goldeneye or mario kart is an absolute nightmare. Avoid buying those sticks on ebay or amazon, they are nothing like original!
The PCB's are back in stock! :)
It seems this might be the last batch... To make it last a little bit longer than the previous one, there will be limit on how many PCB's you can order (= 4).
Quote from: micro on March 18, 2016, 05:58:33 AM
The PCB's are back in stock! :)
It seems this might be the last batch... To make it last a little bit longer than the previous one, there will be limit on how many PCB's you can order (= 4).
Got mine this week, went ahead and installed one of them but after it was all said and done my L & R top triggers were stuck into the on position.
Any ideas on what I could have done wrong? I wired them up per your instruction PDF for the optional Range mode and re-calibrate mode.
I knew they were stuck into the on position because the start button would only work at the beginning of Mario kart and would not pause/jump, and in Goldeneye the weapon zoom was stuck on from the beginning.
I de-soldered the extra wires and the controller works great with the new stick, but removing the optional features obviously.
Picked up my final 4 PCB's @ the post office yesterday. I've got a decent stash of them now. Happy to have been able to get a hold of these.
Hopefully if you ever release the schematics, someone will pick them up and make some, or maybe the manufacturers of the current GC style ones will update to something that actually works worth a damn out of the box.
Quote from: Steve069 on April 12, 2016, 02:25:35 PM
Quote from: micro on March 18, 2016, 05:58:33 AM
The PCB's are back in stock! :)
It seems this might be the last batch... To make it last a little bit longer than the previous one, there will be limit on how many PCB's you can order (= 4).
Got mine this week, went ahead and installed one of them but after it was all said and done my L & R top triggers were stuck into the on position.
Any ideas on what I could have done wrong? I wired them up per your instruction PDF for the optional Range mode and re-calibrate mode.
I knew they were stuck into the on position because the start button would only work at the beginning of Mario kart and would not pause/jump, and in Goldeneye the weapon zoom was stuck on from the beginning.
I de-soldered the extra wires and the controller works great with the new stick, but removing the optional features obviously.
If the L and R buttons are stuck on the "on"position then that means they're shorted to ground. Can you post some good pics showing your wires and solder work?
Just following up here that I put an email order in yesterday for 4 v3s to the US, assuming from the current OP edit that they are still available.
Quote from: micro on April 14, 2016, 05:47:42 PM
Quote from: Steve069 on April 12, 2016, 02:25:35 PM
Quote from: micro on March 18, 2016, 05:58:33 AM
The PCB's are back in stock! :)
It seems this might be the last batch... To make it last a little bit longer than the previous one, there will be limit on how many PCB's you can order (= 4).
Got mine this week, went ahead and installed one of them but after it was all said and done my L & R top triggers were stuck into the on position.
Any ideas on what I could have done wrong? I wired them up per your instruction PDF for the optional Range mode and re-calibrate mode.
I knew they were stuck into the on position because the start button would only work at the beginning of Mario kart and would not pause/jump, and in Goldeneye the weapon zoom was stuck on from the beginning.
I de-soldered the extra wires and the controller works great with the new stick, but removing the optional features obviously.
If the L and R buttons are stuck on the "on"position then that means they're shorted to ground. Can you post some good pics showing your wires and solder work?
I already de-soldered the extra wires. I broke down and ordered a "helping hand" tool like you have that should be here next week, soldering these things can be frustrating because they are so small. I will take some good pictures when I install the second one in my other controller and post them here if I have an issue.
Quote from: micro on April 14, 2016, 05:47:42 PM
Quote from: Steve069 on April 12, 2016, 02:25:35 PM
Quote from: micro on March 18, 2016, 05:58:33 AM
The PCB's are back in stock! :)
It seems this might be the last batch... To make it last a little bit longer than the previous one, there will be limit on how many PCB's you can order (= 4).
Got mine this week, went ahead and installed one of them but after it was all said and done my L & R top triggers were stuck into the on position.
Any ideas on what I could have done wrong? I wired them up per your instruction PDF for the optional Range mode and re-calibrate mode.
I knew they were stuck into the on position because the start button would only work at the beginning of Mario kart and would not pause/jump, and in Goldeneye the weapon zoom was stuck on from the beginning.
I de-soldered the extra wires and the controller works great with the new stick, but removing the optional features obviously.
If the L and R buttons are stuck on the "on"position then that means they're shorted to ground. Can you post some good pics showing your wires and solder work?
Micro, I went ahead and started installing the second PCB into my second controller.
I've been taking a whole bunch of pictures during the process to show you my install in case I ran into a problem.
I stopped when I realized the PCB is mis-labeled on one side...the L & the Z are different on each side, does this matter at all? (One side says this hole is Z, etc. and you flip it over and it says this hole is L). The R appears to be the same on each side tho.
Here are some pics.
(http://i451.photobucket.com/albums/qq234/steveandjimsautoparts/pcb-01.jpg) (http://s451.photobucket.com/user/steveandjimsautoparts/media/pcb-01.jpg.html)
As you can see here, the L solder point is on the edge of the PCB and the Z is on the inside.
(http://i451.photobucket.com/albums/qq234/steveandjimsautoparts/pcb-03.jpg) (http://s451.photobucket.com/user/steveandjimsautoparts/media/pcb-02.jpg.html)
With this pic you can see when its flipped over, the Z is on the outside edge of the PCB and the L is on the inside.
I noticed this was the same with some of the pictures of the previous PCB but maybe no one else caught it (or it doesn't matter, I am not an electrical engineer so IDK).
OOOOOOOOOO I lost the batch!!??! nooooo!! still available ????
Just saying, great job on this project.
I am very interested in ordering, so, what's the current availability?
I have three of the GC-styled sticks and they are far too sensitive.
Thanks in advance
Hey, someone already tested how Super Smash Bros work with this pcb ?? because the gc style is horrible to SSB and i will train advanced techniques. Someone know about high level play style in SSB with this pcb??
Quote from: Junior on April 22, 2016, 01:32:14 PM
Hey, someone already tested how Super Smash Bros work with this pcb ?? because the gc style is horrible to SSB and i will train advanced techniques. Someone know about high level play style in SSB with this pcb??
It works a LOT better. the original GC sticks were hyper sensitive, and doing tilt attacks were pretty difficult without accidentally dashing/jumping when wanting to do those things. There is still a bit of a learning curve to using them, as its different from both the hori minipad and the original sticks, but i could easily see someone getting used to it and being able to do well with them in a more serious setting.
Quote from: micro on April 14, 2016, 05:47:42 PM
Quote from: Steve069 on April 12, 2016, 02:25:35 PM
Quote from: micro on March 18, 2016, 05:58:33 AM
The PCB's are back in stock! :)
It seems this might be the last batch... To make it last a little bit longer than the previous one, there will be limit on how many PCB's you can order (= 4).
Got mine this week, went ahead and installed one of them but after it was all said and done my L & R top triggers were stuck into the on position.
Any ideas on what I could have done wrong? I wired them up per your instruction PDF for the optional Range mode and re-calibrate mode.
I knew they were stuck into the on position because the start button would only work at the beginning of Mario kart and would not pause/jump, and in Goldeneye the weapon zoom was stuck on from the beginning.
I de-soldered the extra wires and the controller works great with the new stick, but removing the optional features obviously.
If the L and R buttons are stuck on the "on"position then that means they're shorted to ground. Can you post some good pics showing your wires and solder work?
Do you have a response to my question about the L&Z pads being labeled differently on each side? I want to finish these controllers up soon and get the extra features working.
Quote from: Vectrexpert64 on April 21, 2016, 08:11:01 PM
Just saying, great job on this project.
I am very interested in ordering, so, what's the current availability?
I have three of the GC-styled sticks and they are far too sensitive.
Thanks in advance
I've got still some left, but only a hand full. If you want some, just send me an email (see 1st post).
Quote from: Steve069 on April 23, 2016, 06:12:06 PM
Do you have a response to my question about the L&Z pads being labeled differently on each side? I want to finish these controllers up soon and get the extra features working.
Yes I'm aware of this "problem" and it has already been discussed some pages ago. It doesn't really matter if you solder the L button to the Z pad or vice versa. Of course, if you solder the L button to the L-pad on the top side and the Z button to the Z-pad on the bottom side, then you got both buttons soldered to the very same pad and it won't work. ;)
But as stated in the installation guide you can also use different combinations (Up + Start for example). L + Z is just the button combination recommended by me. And I can understand that the ambiguous solder pad labels on the top and bottom side can be confusing. ^^
Quote from: micro on April 24, 2016, 12:48:16 AM
Quote from: Vectrexpert64 on April 21, 2016, 08:11:01 PM
Just saying, great job on this project.
I am very interested in ordering, so, what's the current availability?
I have three of the GC-styled sticks and they are far too sensitive.
Thanks in advance
I've got still some left, but only a hand full. If you want some, just send me an email (see 1st post).
Quote from: Steve069 on April 23, 2016, 06:12:06 PM
Do you have a response to my question about the L&Z pads being labeled differently on each side? I want to finish these controllers up soon and get the extra features working.
Yes I'm aware of this "problem" and it has already been discussed some pages ago. It doesn't really matter if you solder the L button to the Z pad or vice versa. Of course, if you solder the L button to the L-pad on the top side and the Z button to the Z-pad on the bottom side, then you got both buttons soldered to the very same pad and it won't work. ;)
But as stated in the installation guide you can also use different combinations (Up + Start for example). L + Z is just the button combination recommended by me. And I can understand that the ambiguous solder pad labels on the top and bottom side can be confusing. ^^
OK I did catch it on now earlier in the thread. I did not realize L&Z apparently do not matter and are the same. I figured they were specific just like the thumbstick 1-2-3-4-5-6 needs to be in the correct order it will be screwed up. I figured there would be a 50-50 chance of wiring the pads wrong.
Hey, the boards are awesome just assembled one from the 3.0 batch today, I've been messing around with the code on your v2.2 boards, what does changing the minrange and maxrange variables do exactly? Because I've been trying to increase the range the joystick outputs to 92 steps in each direction, but when I change min and max range to 92 and use a controller test program on my flash cart I get this weird behavior as I move the joystick upwards, I get increasing output until I get almost to the edge then I get -88, I have the same problem moving the stick to the right. Am I overflowing(I think it's called when you go from the highest integer values to the lowest by adding to it because the number has run out of digits) one of the integer values do you think?
Damn, missed out again. Have been wanting to replace my set of v1.0 PCBs.
does it work on a usb controller?
it works just like the directional. there's no sensitivity. its ON/OFF .
im afraid the hardware is different. it doesnt have this plug, its is direct weldered in the controller. pictures attached
So I made a discovery today, and that is that if you have this yobo controller for the n64(which uses the same shaped hole as the joystick module that comes with these pcbs) and heads up there is another yobo controller for the n64 that has a different joystick cap that will not work for this "mod".
(http://i1365.photobucket.com/albums/r748/Roboplodicus/yobopsjoystick_zpsc390f5d0.jpg)
and you are willing to sacrifice it for it's joystick thumbcap(I'm looking right now for where to buy these thumbsticks right now, if anyones knows where please speak up) and then you cut it down the half dome and only the thing dome part, then you cut up the top half of the standard n64 joystick housing that it is just a dome with a octagon missing on top like this
(http://i1365.photobucket.com/albums/r748/Roboplodicus/20160531_005625_zpsruhc7pzc.jpg)
the bottom of the larger top plastic column (not the smaller lower one that the metal rod goes into) will hit the octagon you have cut out, there by giving you something diagonal values somewhat closer to what a standard n64 joystick would give. I'm currently getting values of about +-70, +-60 in the corners, this could be changed a little with a little xacto-ing though to get even closer to the +-75,+-65 that a new OEM stick corners at. Make sure that you only cut the half dome down to the edge of the larger upper column(you will only be cutting from the sides, not from below) The only catch is a minor one that you don't have anything to prevent random flim flam from falling into your controller, and the stick cap could potentially come off(if it's tugged on) though that can be fixed by (super)gluing the cap onto the metal rod that goes in it. Final product, this mod also has the advantage of providing more precision by virtue of a taller joystick and it has a nice grippy top too.
(http://i1365.photobucket.com/albums/r748/Roboplodicus/20160531_005429_zpsbtjtdant.jpg)
Today I've released the gerber files needed to order the N64 Stick Converter PCB v3 as well as the microcontroller program code. You'll find the link to a archive containing both in the 1st post of this thread. :)
I can also announce that I've made another small batch of the PCB's, if you need one let me know. (See first post.)
Quote from: micro on June 12, 2016, 02:24:36 AM
Today I've released the gerber files needed to order the N64 Stick Converter PCB v3 as well as the microcontroller program code. You'll find the link to a archive containing both in the 1st post of this thread. :)
I can also announce that I've made another small batch of the PCB's, if you need one let me know. (See first post.)
Brilliant! :D Thanks micro!
Any chance you might also release the v2.2 PCB files for those who want to experiment with full size analog sticks?
Quote from: Link83 on June 12, 2016, 02:33:33 AM
Any chance you might also release the v2.2 PCB files for those who want to experiment with full size analog sticks?
@Micro The 2.2 gerber files would be most greatly appreciated, i've actually been messing around with my last couple 2.2 boards over the past couple weeks. Also are you planning on releasing the atmel project files for the code after you finish selling this last batch so we can play around with it ourselves?
To answer both questions: Eventually I might do so. :)
Quote from: micro on June 12, 2016, 11:56:54 PM
To answer both questions: Eventually I might do so. :)
Thanks for considering it micro :)
If you dont mind me asking, what program do you use to design your PCB's? I'm only used to Cadsoft Eagle so just wondered if there might be any .brd files instead of gerbers (I know Eagle can still import gerbers, but you apparently loose certain layers/details in the process?)
@micro I was able to get conrad to ship the joystick/pots to me in Mexico, but the shipping was 45 euros no matter if my order was 5 euros or 50 sort of lame but I might just make a bulk order of like 15 and give some new joysticks to my friends. Conrad will ship almost anywhere except USA and Canada I checked, but atleast to ship to Mexico it's very expensive.
also I was curious if anyone knew where to get replacements for the joystick thumb caps, either the grippy ones that come with the new gen of GC style to upgrade my v2 GC style micro upgraded controllers with the old slippery plastic sticks or these playstation style types that come on yobo's n64 controllers that fit the joysticks in the GC style replacements. The ones in the yobo controller actually do fit but the yobo controller is 15$ a piece that can't be justified just for the joystick.
(http://i1365.photobucket.com/albums/r748/Roboplodicus/yobopsjoystick_zpsc390f5d0.jpg)
@link83 What modifications were you planning on making to the boards?
Quote from: Roboplodicus on June 14, 2016, 12:08:17 PM
@link83 What modifications were you planning on making to the boards?
Well, its just an idea at the moment! but I was planning on only using 'full size' (16mm) analog sticks, so first I was going to remove the smaller analog stick support from the v2.2 PCB designs.
I also want to extend the PCB slightly so I can add a place for the button used on PlayStation/Xbox analog sticks (It would make the PCB a snug fit in the N64 analog stick casing but it should be possible) and then have that button connected up to the extended range pad, so that if you hold down the analog stick button when booting it would increase the diagonal range if required.
Finally I also want to add two holes in the middle of the PCB (beneath the ATiny24 chip) to accomodate the two plastic struts present on the bottom of unmodified GameCube/Wii analog sticks (At least the metal cased Mitsumi versions, not the all-plastic screwed-on versions) I want to use the 'type 2' GameCube analog sticks shown in this thread (Section 2.5):-
http://smashboards.com/threads/technical-knowledge-compilation-gamecubes-controllers-tvs-recording.335040/
Along with some OEM GameCube thumbsticks which I managed to find on ebay.
Basically I want to make a version of the PCB that supports most of the original analog stick mechanisms used by Nintendo/Sony/Microsoft, although obviously to use 'full size' analog sticks it will be necessary to modify the original N64 analog sticks casing to make them fit.
Well, thats the plan anyway! Currently all I have done is import all the gerbers layers from the v3 PCB into Eagle and saved it as a .brd. Unfortunately I lost all the vias/plated holes in the import process, so will have to re-add them and then work from there.
Quote from: Link83 on June 15, 2016, 12:45:30 AM
I also want to extend the PCB slightly so I can add a place for the button used on PlayStation/Xbox analog sticks (It would make the PCB a snug fit in the N64 analog stick casing but it should be possible) and then have that button connected up to the extended range pad, so that if you hold down the analog stick button when booting it would increase the diagonal range if required.
That's a bad idea, because the program requires the stick to be in its untouched, neutral position when the console is turned on. ;)
Quote from: micro on June 15, 2016, 03:11:01 AM
Quote from: Link83 on June 15, 2016, 12:45:30 AM
I also want to extend the PCB slightly so I can add a place for the button used on PlayStation/Xbox analog sticks (It would make the PCB a snug fit in the N64 analog stick casing but it should be possible) and then have that button connected up to the extended range pad, so that if you hold down the analog stick button when booting it would increase the diagonal range if required.
That's a bad idea, because the program requires the stick to be in its untouched, neutral position when the console is turned on. ;)
Doh! I totally forgot it calibrates the neutral position of the analog stick at power on.
Hmm, well i'll probably add the button position anyway - just for compatability with unmodified PlayStation/Xbox/Wii U analog sticks, even if it might be a useless button! ::)
@link82 that sounds like an awesome project please give updates this guy is super interested.
Speaking of using xbox sticks have you put one in a 2.2 board? I put one in the one of my 2.2 boards and I thought it felt like the it needed a software deadzone. Like any tiny movement make Mario in Mario 64 take off. IDK if this is just me. @micro did you ever test out a 360 joystick with the 2.2 board/code and if you did what was your experience?
It's very nice you shared the hex and gerbers!
Is there any chance you could post the schematics aswell? So I could design a different board if needed, instead of reverse engineering yours.
Thanks!
Hi everyone, first post!
Joined to say thanks to the OP for releasing gerbers along with all the required info!! ;)
I'm still waiting for parts to arrive, but if you live in the states you can get a set of 3 x boards manufactured for ~$6 at OSHpark.com! You'll need to generate a cutout layer, but otherwise the files are all that you need to get them made.
Hey Micro, I'm putting together some of these pcbs and I was wondering how to use the pogo pins to program the attiny24's. I first solder them and the resistor to the board but the pins you linked to were too small for the 6 holes that I think are used from programming...What is the setup you used to program your boards?
I don't know where I wrote about the pogo pins, but it certainly wasn't in this thread. ^^ The N64 Stick Converter PCB V3 got pretty big holes for the ISP interface. Actually you don't need pogo pins at all. Just insert standard 2.54 mm pin headers into your 6-pin programming cable. Insert the cable and tilt it to establish a good connection, and then start the flashing process:
(http://i.imgur.com/NrHrxlm.jpg)
Quote from: KaBoomPow on July 04, 2016, 01:59:33 PM
Hi everyone, first post!
Joined to say thanks to the OP for releasing gerbers along with all the required info!! ;)
I'm still waiting for parts to arrive, but if you live in the states you can get a set of 3 x boards manufactured for ~$6 at OSHpark.com! You'll need to generate a cutout layer, but otherwise the files are all that you need to get them made.
You're welcome. :)
But I don't know if Oshpark is the perfect choice for this PCB. Oshpark produces PCB's with a thickness of 1.6mm. The N64 Stick Converter PCB on the other hand should be 1.2 mm thick...
You might end up with being unable to close the stick housing because of the extra thickness.
Quote from: micro on July 20, 2016, 08:37:59 AM
I don't know where I wrote about the pogo pins, but it certainly wasn't in this thread. ^^ The N64 Stick Converter PCB V3 got pretty big holes for the ISP interface. Actually you don't need pogo pins at all.
...
Quote from: KaBoomPow on July 04, 2016, 01:59:33 PM
Hi everyone, first post!
Joined to say thanks to the OP for releasing gerbers along with all the required info!! ;)
I'm still waiting for parts to arrive, but if you live in the states you can get a set of 3 x boards manufactured for ~$6 at OSHpark.com! You'll need to generate a cutout layer, but otherwise the files are all that you need to get them made.
You're welcome. :)
But I don't know if Oshpark is the perfect choice for this PCB. Oshpark produces PCB's with a thickness of 1.6mm. The N64 Stick Converter PCB on the other hand should be 1.2 mm thick...
You might end up with being unable to close the stick housing because of the extra thickness.
Ya it was someone else that linked to the pogo pins that's ok they were only like 2$. To program the microcontroller I thought you needed a power source independent of the programmer?
Also I got 3 of these boards from oshpark, and the while you still can close the stick housing, the extra thickness causes the joystick to hit the joysticks metal circle physically before it hits the stick housing corners, though because the stick sits higher the actual angle range is slightly greater than with a 1.2 board so the joystick feels a tiny bit less sensitive, so those are the pros and cons for ordering from oshpark.
QuoteTo program the microcontroller I thought you needed a power source independent of the programmer?
That depends on the programmer you're using.
Do you have any idea if this programmer needs outside power to program attiny24s?
https://www.amazon.com/SainSmart-Programmer-ATMEL-ATMega-ATTiny/dp/B0051SRZWC/192-1949746-2528242?ie=UTF8&keywords=usbasp&qid=1375327991&ref_=sr_1_1&s=electronics&sr=1-1
Hello, I recently acquired the GC style stick but I'm having issues with its over-sensitivity, as expected.
After partially reading this thread, I'm considering buying some PCBs to mod my controllers.
Problem is, I'm Brazilian. Do you have any plans on shipping to Brazil in the future?
Hey Mirco!
I emailed you a week ago and got a response that you had some in stock. Emailed you back with my address/information and have not heard back since. Let me know what I owe and I will have you paid ASAP. Thank you!
Quote from: micro on March 13, 2015, 08:57:38 AMtext
I wanted to thank you micro for creating these PCB:s!
Bought a few last year and couldn't hold myself from buying a few more earlier this year.
Due to work and the tons of shit I couldn't build my first controller until about 3 weeks ago.
And all I can say is that I love it ;D
Thanks again micro you beautiful genius!
Got mine and installed it yesterday.
Love it. Thank u Micro.
I got some third party controllers where the joystick looks like a wierd child of the original n64 joysticck and a analog joystick with only four cables going to the gamepad has anybody tried the chip on these?
Hey everyone first time user with these PCB's was pretty excited to get some!
finished installing my first one and I have come across a little issue. I can't help but notice that the analogue isn't calibrating properly it seems that the deadzones are out quite a bit. I have noticed when playing goldeneye and super mario 64 the deadzones come into play quite a bit. I have an attachment showing Micros PCB compared to an original n64 joystick . I have calibrated my board multiple times but to have no effect on any changes/improvements.
Any ideas on how to fix this issue?
I've attached the microcontroller's source code to the 1st post. :)
@iacka: Hmm, usually the term "dead zone" describes the travel of the stick in the neutral position before a change in position is registered by the controller/console. So do you really mean dead zone in the traditional sense?
I can see that the test result pic you've provided doesn't look too nice. How does it affect Goldeneye and especially Mario 64? Can't Mario run at full speed when pushed up-right?
Have you already checked your soldering? Is the joystick even on the PCB? Are the joystick's solder joints ok?
The way the calibration function works is following: It measures the minimum and maximum voltage that the two joystick's potentiometers are producing while you move the stick to the boundaries. The scaling factors generated by the calibration function guarantee that in the end the range of each axis (x & y) will at least be +/- 81. But because the stick+PCB+restrictor gate isn't 100.0% aligned and the potentiometer is not perfectly linear, chances are that one direction will produce higher values than the opposite side. So there's a cap implemented which limits the range down to 84. That means the end result with your test program won't be a perfect octagon.
But still, if I compare your pic with this one (http://s9.zetaboards.com/Nintendo_64_Forever/single/?p=8115071&t=7360571), yours seem to be deviant...
Have you assembled another PCB and does it show the same behaviour?
Just sent you an order for four PCB. Thank you for the continued support and development on this.
Where you buy those gamecube style stick because i see theme at 45$ now... is it a new revision that dont need mod?
@micro yeah exactly right! Mario cant run full speed when pushed up-right as well as right and down-right
I've checked my soldering and made sure that the PCB is flush with the potentiometer
I have assembled 3 out of 4 and they all have the same result unfortunately, I have also tried turning on extended range mode but still had very poor calibration.
Starting to run out of ideas :(
(http://i1376.photobucket.com/albums/ah27/iacka/20161226_112710_zpswkzbhx7s.jpg) (http://s1376.photobucket.com/user/iacka/media/20161226_112710_zpswkzbhx7s.jpg.html)
(http://i1376.photobucket.com/albums/ah27/iacka/20161226_112643_zpspfdlju4t.jpg) (http://s1376.photobucket.com/user/iacka/media/20161226_112643_zpspfdlju4t.jpg.html)
Your solder work looks fine to me.
Did you use the same GC-style stick shell to test the 3 assembled PCB's so far?
Where to buy completed N64 updated PCB thumbstick ? (New PCB with plastic shell)
Yeah I have actually I might try and dissassemble another control stick and use that shell see if it makes any difference.
Do you think it might have anything with the cable that plugs into the controller from the PCB? Damaged cable possibly not producing the right voltages?
ok so I have just tested another PCB in an entirely new control stick (ie new plastic shell and new cable). I can't believe this is still not working as intended. It actually gave me the same results as last time if not worse! I have tried everything. New control stick shell, different PCBs and even a different controller to test everything with.
My only assumption is that I may have got a faulty batch?
Any assistance on this would be much appreciated!
(http://i1376.photobucket.com/albums/ah27/iacka/20170108_1546371_zpsxud9bywi.jpg) (http://s1376.photobucket.com/user/iacka/media/20170108_1546371_zpsxud9bywi.jpg.html)
(http://i1376.photobucket.com/albums/ah27/iacka/20170108_1550311_zpsxprmibwu.jpg) (http://s1376.photobucket.com/user/iacka/media/20170108_1550311_zpsxprmibwu.jpg.html)>
What brand/model analog sticks are you using? micro's PCB's used part number 98002C6:-
https://www.conrad.de/de/joystick-12-vdc-metallhebel-gerade-loetpins-98002c6-1-st-425609.html
The 3rd party N64 sticks use low quality analog sticks which only reach 38°, whereas the one micro uses can reach 60°.
Theres more info about this on the 2nd page of the installation pdf linked in the first post.
HELP ME SOMEONE !!! Where to buy updated completed GC Style N64 stick ??? (with shell etc.)
Hey lads, ordered and assembled four PCB's a little while ago. Used the V3 GameCube sticks sold by Mortoff Games.
I finally received my flashcart today so that I could test my results. Two were perfectly calibrated, one had to be re-calibrated in order to get the proper results, and then there was one which gave me the following result:
(https://seehofer.nl/img/controllertest.jpg)
Are there any conclusions one might be able to pull from just this result? I have the same problem as iacka, where re-calibrating only gives the same result. I am using the L+Z re-calibration method.
I haven't used any 3rd party accessories (including the joystick) only ones provided from micro
WHY NOT HELP ANY PEOPLE ??? Where to buy pcb 3 n64 stick ?
This analog stick is good ?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEWEST-Version-3-Gamecube-Style-Thumbstick-Joystick-Repair-for-N64-Controller-/171993923449?hash=item280ba2ff79:m:mz9wah0d0_xDU2210hB-LiQ
Quote from: Nintendo64 on January 14, 2017, 12:40:07 AM
WHY NOT HELP ANY PEOPLE ??? Where to buy pcb 3 n64 stick ?
This analog stick is good ?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEWEST-Version-3-Gamecube-Style-Thumbstick-Joystick-Repair-for-N64-Controller-/171993923449?hash=item280ba2ff79:m:mz9wah0d0_xDU2210hB-LiQ
Those are fine, you can use the PCB's with any which look like that. There are no special requirements.
Okay thanks, but which is the best choice replacement stick ? I find other cheaper sticks. Which is the best choice ? (durability/sensitivity)
This two sticks was cheaper then previous
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Brand-New-Nintendo-N64-Replacement-Thumbstick-Joystick-/291792557979?hash=item43f031179b:g:7bIAAOSwepJXYHrz
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Gamecube-GC-Style-REPLACEMENT-Joystick-Thumbstick-Repair-Box-for-N64-Nintendo-64-/151705535398?hash=item23525ac3a6:g:mJoAAOSweW5Vcwzi
and I found other thumbstick:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Set-of-2-New-Replacement-Joysticks-for-N64-Controller-Nintendo-64-Thumbstick-/251506851050?hash=item3a8ef9fcea:g:eIMAAOxycD9TTpNU
What is the best choice ?
Ok, I've had a look into this. I don't own an Everdrive and therefore I cannot use the same controller test program. But I've got another device to read out the N64 controller. I noted the controller stick position values and put them into a Excel sheet. (Excel sheet attached to this post.)
(http://i.imgur.com/udAnHJBl.png) (http://imgur.com/udAnHJB)
1) At first I've tested my old GC style stick with a v2 Stick Converter PCB inside. It's the blue line and it looks perfectly ok.
2) After that I've assembled a v3 PCB set from the current batch. I installed it and the test results look pretty much like the ones shown by Seroczynski (red linde).
3) Finally I've desoldered the potentiometer stick from the v2 PCB and soldered it to the v3 PCB. The pins of the stick got a little bit bit bent during the desoldering process. After calibrating I've tested the stick again and now it looked pretty much than the old v2 PCB (green line).
My conclusions so far:
1) The v3 PCB's of this batch not faulty. They're working like they always have.
2) The accuracy/linearity of the potentiometer sticks seems to vary. But I don't know if the recent batch is worse than those before (or even out of specs).
I've been buying the same sticks (https://www.conrad.de/de/joystick-12-vdc-metallhebel-gerade-loetpins-98002c6-1-st-425609.html), same specs. Also the markings on the potentiometer sticks are the same (60, 6, B, 103).
Right now I'm guessing that it's normal that some potentiometer stick got a better or worse linearity than others. Seroczynski also said his other sticks got "better" test results.
3) There's no guarantee that after calibration you'll get a perfect octagon on your controller test program. Just look at the test results of other potentiometer-based N64 sticks, they can look really wild.
But even if the test result looks like the red one I've tested, then it doesn't necessarily mean the stick is unplayable.
4) @iacka: It's actually the first time that someone said he can't run at full speed in Mario64 with that N64 Stick Converter. Of course that's a real problem and should definitively not occur. I'll contact you soon via email to resolve that issue. :)
5) I got an idea for different calibration method. Maybe that *could* tackle the problems that occur when the potentiometer stick's linearity is worse than it should be. Unfortunately I don't have time for that at moment, but it will give it a try for sure.
Thanks micro, for taking the time to test this to this extend. I'd wanted to clarify that when I said I had "better" results, I was talking about results similar to the blue line in your graphs.
I think I'll just leave it for now. If I ever want to achieve a similar result as the blue line, and not like the red line, would it be enough to try another potentiometer from Conrad?
Yes I guess you could try another potentiometer stick, although there's no guarantee you'll get a better stick from Conrad. Actually you only would need new potentiometers (the orange thingy). They can be unclipped from the metal stick body and swapped. But unfortunately there's no source for the potentiometers...
Well, I've been working on another firmware this weekend. It works a little different than before and should be better suited for lopsided potentiometer sticks as shown here in the last posts. So far the results look promising:
(http://i.imgur.com/OYSOyOll.png) (http://imgur.com/OYSOyOl)
If used the very same potentiometer stick which gave me the red line with v3 PCB before. With the new firmware the same stick now seems to be much more even (blue line).
Do you have a ISP programmer for Atmel microcontrollers? In that case you could try out the new firmware.
That is quite a difference, nice work. I don't have a programmer, but might be able to ask my brother-in-law.
Even if your brother hasn't a programming device, you can buy it yourself. On Aliexpress you can get it for insanely low prices. 2$ shipped for both the programmer and the 10->6 pin adaptor!
- USBasp programmer for Atmel microcontrollers
1.43$: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/USBasp-USBISP-3-3V-5V-AVR-Programmer-USB-ATMEGA8-L/2036883289.html
1.18$: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1LOT-New-USBASP-USBISP-AVR-Programmer-USB-ISP-USB-ASP-ATMEGA8-ATMEGA128-Support-Win7-64/32727211265.html - 10 -> 6 pin ISP adaptor
0.45$: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/10-Pin-to-6-Pin-Adapter-Board-for-AVRISP-MKII-USBASP-STK500-High-Quality/1925169384.html
0.49$: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Free-Shipping-10-Pin-to-6-Pin-Adapter-Board-for-AVRISP-MKII-USBASP-STK500-High-Quality/32627636397.html - 2.54mm pinheader (only needed if you don't have one already in your parts drawer)
0.60$: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/20pcs-Lot-Gold-plated-Single-Row-1x40-pin-2-54mm-Male-Header-Free-shipping-hot-sales/670908618.html
0.59$: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/10pcs-40-Pin-1x40-Single-Row-Male-2-54-Breakable-Pin-Header-Connector-Strip-for-Arduino/32758380907.html
I'll do more work and testing on the firmware tomorrow (hopefully). If everything's ok I will upload the firmware. So everyone with the 2$ programmer linked above will be able to update the firmware of the N64 Stick Converter PCB.
I also intend to write up a small tutorial how to update the firmware and which programming tool to use.
Quote from: micro on January 22, 2017, 03:28:59 AM
Even if your brother hasn't a programming device, you can buy it yourself. On Aliexpress you can get it for insanely low prices. 2$ shipped for both the programmer and the 10->6 pin adaptor!
- USBasp programmer for Atmel microcontrollers
1.43$: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/USBasp-USBISP-3-3V-5V-AVR-Programmer-USB-ATMEGA8-L/2036883289.html
1.18$: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1LOT-New-USBASP-USBISP-AVR-Programmer-USB-ISP-USB-ASP-ATMEGA8-ATMEGA128-Support-Win7-64/32727211265.html - 10 -> 6 pin ISP adaptor
0.45$: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/10-Pin-to-6-Pin-Adapter-Board-for-AVRISP-MKII-USBASP-STK500-High-Quality/1925169384.html
0.49$: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Free-Shipping-10-Pin-to-6-Pin-Adapter-Board-for-AVRISP-MKII-USBASP-STK500-High-Quality/32627636397.html - 2.54mm pinheader (only needed if you don't have one already in your parts drawer)
0.60$: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/20pcs-Lot-Gold-plated-Single-Row-1x40-pin-2-54mm-Male-Header-Free-shipping-hot-sales/670908618.html
0.59$: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/10pcs-40-Pin-1x40-Single-Row-Male-2-54-Breakable-Pin-Header-Connector-Strip-for-Arduino/32758380907.html
I'll do more work and testing on the firmware tomorrow (hopefully). If everything's ok I will upload the firmware. So everyone with the 2$ programmer linked above will be able to update the firmware of the N64 Stick Converter PCB.
I also intend to write up a small tutorial how to update the firmware and which programming tool to use.
Do you need one of everything here? or are the programers and adapters redundant? either way, i just ordered one of everything, since it still only totaled like 5$.
I've been trying to find a good way to make sure the joysticks i buy are the new ones that you dont have to carve apart with a knife. I might try and order a couple from ebay that only have a picture of the new one (held together w/ a screw).
Also yes, a tutorial how to update the firmware would be great.
You need one programmer and one 10->6 pin adaptor.
I've uploaded the new v3.5 firmware and a firmware update guide. Links can be found in the 1st post. :)
Quote from: micro on January 24, 2017, 08:52:54 AM
You need one programmer and one 10->6 pin adaptor.
I've uploaded the new v3.5 firmware and a firmware update guide. Links can be found in the 1st post. :)
I'll check it out when I have the programmer in hand! which im sure will be a month or two from now. i guess the benefit of ordering 2 is now they get to RACE each other across the world!
Quote from: micro on January 24, 2017, 08:52:54 AM
You need one programmer and one 10->6 pin adaptor.
I've uploaded the new v3.5 firmware and a firmware update guide. Links can be found in the 1st post. :)
This is greatly appreciated. Didn't even ask my brother in law because I find this very interesting to do myself. Thanks for listing the items, posting the firmware and the guide. Will report back once I've received everything and got around to updating, will take a while.
Thanks for sharing your hard work with us, Micro. Really appreciate it!
micro, I'll add my thanks for sharing your creation! I managed to build 4 replacement units that work perfectly. I had been using the stock GC style replacement joystick but I was having a hard time aiming in different games. After the conversion, the joystick replacement works perfectly and I have no problems aiming.
If anyone is planning to build these joysticks, I bought the parts off eBay.
The GC style joysticks were bought from eBay vendor "nintendoplayerschoice". The listing for the "old" GC style joystick (Simple Jet V2.0 version) is here: http://www.ebay.com/itm/171568010491
A UK-based eBay vendor "vila_restor" sells the correct 60 degree joystick. The listing for the joystick is here: http://www.ebay.com/itm/111355294683
Thanks micro!
I bought an ebay gc style thumbstick, I'ts very sensitive, can I upgrade the firmware on this ebay stick to 3.5 ? What I need to upgrade firmware my ebay thumbstick ?
No, that's not possible of course. I got the feeling you're totally lost, Nintendo64. The 3.5 firmware you're mentioning is of course meant to be used with the N64 Stick Converter PCB. That's what this thread is all about. Check the 1st post for all the neccessary files and links to build such a N64 Stick Converter PCB.
Hi.
Are you still making these pcbs? And how do i order one?
Howwy, see first post "how to order", I got them back in stock! :)
I get an error when trying to send an e-mail to order a PCB set to the address in the first post.
550 Mailbox unavaiable
Final-Recipient: rfc822; v3@borscht.33mail.com
Action: failed
Status: 5.0.0
Remote-MTA: dns; smtp1.ec2.33mail.com. (54.175.71.36, the server for the
domain borscht.33mail.com.)
Diagnostic-Code: smtp; 550 Mailbox unavaiable
Last-Attempt-Date: Wed, 01 Mar 2017 07:47:53 -0800 (PST)
Thanks for the report, it should be fixed now. :)
Hey, i tried building one of these and i have the PCB all soldered up.. Well everything except for the switch, and was able to successfully download the c-code on to the chip but when I try to use it with my n64 it does nothing.. What program did you use to burn the code? I got a few boards and tried again on another one with another controller and it says that the burn was successfully completed(i made sure i entered both HEX and EEPROM files, as well as set the fuses). I made sure i soldered the white wire nearest the inside and soldered the rest in order as mentioned. Any suggestions?
I may have gotten the order of the wires wrong that i soldered from the connector to the PCB, i have the 2nd revision of the gamecube style stick. Is there anyway i can get a picture of which wire goes where? :o or a picture of the connector with what each wire is?
This is how i have the board wired.
Is that correct?
Wiring is probably ok. After all, you just need to follow the steps described in the pdf to install the wires correctly.
It's possible that you're using a cheap ISP programmer to flash the microcontroller. These typically provide power to the chip which cannot be turned pff after programming. That means after programming the microcontroller, it will start to execute the calibration function. But you're not ready to wiggle the stick yet. And then you remove the programmer, the calibration is already finished but without a valid result.
Once you turn the console & controller on, nothing works because of this faulty executed calibration.
Solution:
1) Flip the switch after programming the microcontroller (d'oh! ^^)
2) Execute the calibration again by holding L+Z while turning the console on. You have to wire up these buttons of course as shown in the pdf.
That was 100% the issue. Thank you for all the hard work and dedication to this! I feel like this is how the N64 joystick should of been when they released the console.
Just a quick question. The difference about the v3 and v3.5 firmware is like night and day or there is only a small difference? I don't really want to buy everything and have the work of updating the firmware unless there is a huge difference.
As you can see in this post (http://nfggames.com/forum2/index.php?topic=5803.msg42843#msg42843) the v3.5 firmware will result in more evenly maximum ranges in combination with lopsided potentiometer sticks.
Night & day difference? Not quite...
If you haven't experienced any (range) problems yet then there should be no need for updating the firmware.
Thanks for the quick answers. Can you recommend a software to test the range of my controllers?
I will probably buy two more pcb soon because i have two controllers that are almost dying and i want to have four controllers with the pcb. If i purchase the new pcb they are going to come updated with firmware v3.5? Last question, do you sell a decent quality gamecube stick to put the PCB? Here in my country they only sell very cheap chinese gamecube sticks.
Quote from: skaman on January 29, 2017, 05:41:33 PM
A UK-based eBay vendor "vila_restor" sells the correct 60 degree joystick. The listing for the joystick is here: http://www.ebay.com/itm/111355294683
It is a very smooth joystick with little resistance and returns to center very well. I really think it is a great upgraded stick.
I have finally received the USB programmer and everything else required to flash the 3.5 firmware to my PCB (a shipment was cancelled due to whatever reason, delaying the delivery). I'll report on this soon :)
So after waiting several months for my USB programmers from aliexpress (like Seroczynski my order was canceled with no notifications letting me know why it got cancelled. Ended up ordering from a different seller.). I successfully flashed firmware v3.5 on my PCB's and I can confirm this has made quite a difference in my experience. I am very happy micro took the time to develop new firmware and write instructions on how to flash everything, thank you very much micro. I have attached a pic comparing the results of what i had previously to the current v3.5. I think you can guess which is which ;)
(http://i1376.photobucket.com/albums/ah27/iacka/IMG_20170508_201944_zpsohioewpn.jpg) (http://s1376.photobucket.com/user/iacka/media/IMG_20170508_201944_zpsohioewpn.jpg.html)
I finally got to it. Thanks to you excellent guide I was done in about five minutes and the result is great! See for yourself :)
Before (with firmware 3.0)
(https://tweakers.net/ext/f/O9nu0uUxVee36PfV2aUFnuG6/full.jpg)
After (with firmware 3.5)
(https://tweakers.net/ext/f/78PGexnTlABXeRVnwXZ4gEq9/full.jpg)
Hi there, Micro! I've got a question. When using your mod, I feel there's just a tad bit too much deadzone in the "+"-directions.
Is it supposed to do this, or have I done something wrong? (bad batch of pots, as mentioned above perhaps?)
I've put together two or three and they all seem to have the same range and deadzones, unfortunately I've got no software for testing the range of the stick.
Would possibly the 3.5 firmware fix this, or is it something I could do myself with the right equipment?
Thanks!
Is there any way to rewrite the code so that the maximum range reaches 100?
Hi micro, please, can you tell me why you do not ship to Brazil?
Please, here we need this improvement too :(
Please allow us braziliens to order and enjoy this
great solution.
Ordered mine! Do the new ones come with the latest firmware, or will I have to flash them myself?
Dear Micro !
I want to build N64 micro converter for me, please help me, I choosed this parts for build:
Micro Programmer:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/USBASP-USB-ISP-AVR-Programmer-Adapter-51-10-Pin-Cable-USB-ATMEGA8-ATMEGA128-W4G8-/122608404135?epid=571977239&hash=item1c8c07c6a7:g:XjYAAOSwFJBZcNQ3
Capacitor 100nf:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/100PCS-100nF-0-1uF-50V-10-X7R-0805-2012-SMD-capacitor-MLCC-2-0mm-1-2mm-NEW-/252770361185?hash=item3ada499f61:g:LuUAAOSwWxNYotvY
Joystick:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Nintendo-GameCube-Joystick-Potentiometer-10K-Thumb-Game-Repair-Replacement-/121656555784?epid=16002497172&hash=item1c534bb908:g:UWwAAOSwiLdWCk~R
Resistor:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/100pcs-10K-ohm-10KR-1-0805-2012-1-8W-SMD-Chip-Resistor-2mm-1-2mm-/332066123184?hash=item4d50aeedb0:g:on8AAOSwys5WUskx
Microcontroller:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/1pcs-ATTINY24A-SSU-SOIC14-AVR-ATTINY24A-ATTINY24-/381375108630?hash=item58cbba5616:g:Jq8AAOSwxH1T1l6J
And I cutting the board from prototype PCB, like this:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/5Pcs-Double-Side-5x7cm-Printed-Circuit-PCB-Vero-Prototyping-Track-Strip-Board-LW-/172129140619?epid=1254422972&hash=item2813b23f8b:g:9ksAAOSwxp9W4cQL
And I have one question, can you link me for circuit diagram from V3.5 micro PCB ?
Thanks !
So I've assembled four of the sticks myself. Ordered straight off the list and flashed with an aliexpress USBasp programmer as recommended. My issue is this. The stick calibrates successfully and seems great for the first 30sec-1min of gameplay. Over time however, the neutral zone (0,0) slowly drifts left. In other words, the neutral position gradually changes from 0,0 to -10,0 -20,0 -30,0 etc. This means that after a minute or two of gameplay it becomes impossible to turn right, pushing the joystick right accomplishes less and less. I'm at a loss for what to do here. My soldering work looks decent IMO across all four boards. Any ideas, help, thoughts about what could be the issue? I have an everdrive so I have verified my feelings in games with the actual joystick numbers from the joystick test rom. Let me know. Thanks all.
I may have missed it, but what is the new way to invert Y for the stick?
@micro: Any plans on releasing the source code for version 3.5?
I wanna try to patch it so that it works with the stock SIMPLE JET V2.0 C PCB and an ATTINY261a as per @blecky http://freneticrapport.blogspot.ca/2015/03/n64-gc-replacement-stick-controller-ic.html
Thanks!
Hi all :). Been using four of these (V3) (and loving it) over the past two or so years and after unshelving my controllers recently one of them the analog stopped working :(, any idea on how to troubleshoot this? Tried recalibrating but I'm suspecting it might be either an issue on the IC on the PCB or with the N64 controller board itself.
I'm in Brazil so I can't get a replacement (I'd suggest offering only EMS to Brazil if shipping is the issue).
I have amateurish knowledge on electronics but I suppose I could check the VCC on the PCB for the nominal values on the datasheet with the controller turned on to see if the IC still lives? Any ideas on how to check if the ATTiny24A is the issue, I find it hard for the potentiometer to be the issue. I'll also try replacing the controller PCB after checking if all the pads and traces on the board are OK.
UPDATE:
Found my multimeter and tested for continuity between the components on the PCB and the Controller board and all is a 100% as it was before. I'm now assuming somehow the EEPROM got corrupted and will try to re-flash it with a USB programmer. If that doesn't work I'll swap controller boards and if that still doesn't work I'll grab a new ATTiny24A. Maybe a slight surge on the console power-up corrupted the EEPROM? :-\
Hey Micro, I know these have been out a long time now, but by chance is there any stock left? I shot you a PM and e-mail to the address in the first post. Thanks!
Quote from: micro on March 13, 2015, 08:57:38 AM
- No need to ask for availability. As long as you can see the email address above, the PCB sets are available.
A part of me is still hoping there is some truth in this. I've send you two emails, the second one with my address reformatted, because I thought the previous format might have been the reason that I didn't get a response. It's been a while now and I would very much like to hear if there are still some of these available, because I would very much like one.
Please let me know.
I was thinking about the octagonal stick restrictor on the replacement stick, and how it differs from the original. The current solution is to scale the output so that either the x-/y-axis are correct, or so that the diagonals are correct. This is how it looks currently
(https://i.imgur.com/sFBqYUL.png) (https://i.imgur.com/sFBqYUL.png)
The reason that the standard range works only on the x-/y-axis and extended range only on the diagonals is that Micro has used constant scaling over the whole range. If linear scaling is applied something like this could instead be achieved
(https://i.imgur.com/jRbjrPM.png) (https://i.imgur.com/jRbjrPM.png)
Thus, with this scaling it is possible to almost perfectly map the endpoints of the octagonal gate of the replacement stick to the output from an original N64 stick. The scaling also works well for the inner region, i.e. when the stick is not fully tilted. The idea behind my suggested scaling is to use Micro's standard range when on the x-/y-axis, and the extended range when on the diagonals. If inbetween, a combination is used so that the closer you are to one of the diagonals, the more extra scaling is applied. The code for this algorithm can be implemented quite efficiently, so it should be possible to run on the attiny Micro uses with his PCB. I don't personally have enough experience to build the firmware though, and besides Micro hasn't posted the source code for his latest firmware version. Too bad that Micro doesn't seem to be active here anymore :'(
Quote from: Link83 on July 15, 2015, 12:57:48 PM
Great work micro! :D I just had a few questions about the 'extended range mode' if you dont mind...
So I understand that the original N64 analog stick restrictor is more a square-ish octagon shape, rather than a true octagon like the GC style sticks (Not my pic):-
(http://i.imgur.com/lv4gl2Hl.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/lv4gl2H.jpg)
Heres a picture of a new original N64 analog sticks range taken with sanni's N64 controller test rom:-
(http://i.imgur.com/w6BkFwk.png)
The original N64 converter used 168 steps (Which I think was based on the up-down, left-right analog stick measurements?) which means if you use a replacement analog stick with an octagonal or circular restrictor you end up with these ranges:-
(http://i.imgur.com/agiLtfh.png)
Red = Original N64 Restrictor
Blue = Octagonal Restrictor (GameCube/Wii Style)
Green = Circular Restrictor (PlayStation/Xbox Style)
This means you dont quite have the maximum range for the diagonals, which is the problem experienced by MockyLock with GoldenEye/Perfect Dark using v2:-
http://nfggames.com/forum2/index.php?topic=5023.msg35647#msg35647
Does the 'extended range mode' try to modify the analog stick values into a more square-ish shape, or does it simply extend the range using the number of steps for the diagonal size, like this?:-
(http://i.imgur.com/gVHaUZ0.png)
In which case the 'extended range mode' has the full range of an original N64 analog stick, but slightly more range in some directions than originally intended (Plus if you have a limited area of movement [Small restrictor] like some of the third party GC style analog sticks, then the stick could be too sensitive)
I'm also curious to know what the maximum number of steps is for the original diagonal ranges? I'm guessing around 190 steps? (13% increase) and would a value somewhere in between the two (Perhaps 180 steps) work for GoldenEye/Perfect Dark?
I just personally would prefer to have 'one mode' for all games - even if that means I have to compromise slightly with more range for some games than originally intended :)
Quote from: Informationator on July 17, 2015, 05:00:44 AM
Interesting question, Link. I'm also curious as to whether the joystick would calibrate properly if I carefully modified the octogonal gate to match that of the N64's gate. With some careful measurements and markings and a file I imagine you could get very close to perfect.
Or... If, the angles would be too severe with a 18mm and 20mm measurements, you could leave the cardinal directions at 16mm and carefully file the diagionals out to ~17.8mm, and the ratio would be faithful to the .9 ratio of the N64 controller's gate points.
Quote from: sanni on July 30, 2015, 02:03:43 AM
Quote from: Link83 on July 15, 2015, 12:57:48 PM
I'm also curious to know what the maximum number of steps is for the original diagonal ranges? I'm guessing around 190 steps?
There are about ~83-85 steps for up/down/left/right and diagonally the x/y values are between ~67-70 on a new controller.
So the overall "traveling distance" between e.g. the lower left and the upper right corner would be the square root of ((2*68)²+(2*68)²) so about 192.
Can you please also release the files for pcb v2? I prefer to use the ps2 analog.
Hey everyone. I'm trying to get the parts to build one of these. Does anyone know of a good way to buy the joystick in the United States?
EDIT: I found these - https://www.rapidonline.com/Catalogue/Product/51-7063
Do they look correct? RapidOnline appears to ship to USA. I also saw the E-Bay link on page 7.
Quote from: OcrainaOfTime on May 27, 2019, 08:57:13 PM
Hey everyone. I'm trying to get the parts to build one of these. Does anyone know of a good way to buy the joystick in the United States?
EDIT: I found these - https://www.rapidonline.com/Catalogue/Product/51-7063
Do they look correct? RapidOnline appears to ship to USA. I also saw the E-Bay link on page 7.
I got mines from this ebay UK seller spiratronics
They also have a website http://spiratronics.com
https://www.ebay.ca/itm/Nintendo-Wii-Joystick-Potentiometer-10K-Thumb-Game-Repair-Replacement/291470358607
Thanks
@Daijoubu for that info. I ordered all the parts, and I was able to build my own board. :) However, the values for the diagonal upper left and diagonal lower right are very low. In Mario 64, for example, Mario runs quickly in all directions besides those two (which are polar opposites by the way). In those two directions, he just walks. Does anyone have any ideas why this is? I'm attaching a screenshot of my range results. Also, as you can see, the point of center is slightly off from what it should be. Also, if I move the controller, it affects the control stick (without actually moving the control stick). Maybe my testing tool is just really sensitive, but it's worth mentioning. Do you think it is my soldering, or perhaps the potentiometer is the culprit? Thanks in advance.
EDIT: I am not sure how to upload the screenshot of my results. The site just gives me an error: "Unable to create a new attachment directory. Your attachment or avatar cannot be saved." But it basically looks like the octagon you would expect but with the upper left and lower right diagonals just flat.
Is the OP no longer providing this service? I sent a email including my purchase amount of 2, name, address, and country a few weeks ago but no response :/
It might be worth emailing them more than once, or pming them here.
Although it's extremely common for people that do cool projects like this to not support them years later.
It's not exactly a lucrative business making kits and stuff. Usually people buy a set batch of parts and once those sell, they move on to something else.
OP was nice enough to make it open source, but good luck finding those potentiometers. Looks like the original links are dead
I mentioned in another thread recently (https://nfggames.com/forum2/index.php?topic=6699.0) that the PMs on this forum do not automatically send out an email, unless you opt in to that. It's a batshit stupid system and I'm terribly sorry, but the developers of this forum won't change it.
So your messages might not be sending the right signals to the right people. Sorry about that.
I'm afraid to say micro hasn't been seen online in years :( His forum account here was last active in October 2017 and AFAIK the same applies to his circuit-board.de account. Maybe he has just been very busy with other things, I just really hope he is ok.
I discovered something that might be useful to others regarding an easier way to improve the GC-style joysticks.
I made some of these kits for myself and out of interest, I decided to see what would happen if I only replaced the analog stick of my overly-sensitive GC-style joysticks with the ones mentioned on page 1 in this thread. To my surprise it actually works MUCH better. It's not quite as good as doing the full conversion, but it is a LOT better than the stock GC-style joysticks - GoldenEye007 actually becomes playable again. It still has the same problem of over sensitivity but to a far, far less extent. This may be an attractive option to anyone wanting a less-involved mod.
In my GC-style joysticks the stock potentiometers were 10k just like the ones mentioned on page 1, but instead of having a '60' in the top left corner, they had '38'. This number refers to the angle at which you have to tilt before the resistance is at its boundary (something like this anyway).
Removing the analog is a bit fiddly, but it's possible to pry off the two 3-pin variable resistors and desolder them individually before tackling the 4 pins of the stick. Be careful not to accidentally desolder any of the surface-mounted resistors. To remove the stick, I held the thumbstick back (the metal casing it will get hot) to provide some lifting force while heating up the 2 far pins. Once the 2 pins lift off the board a bit, cut them and repeat for the other side. To remove the pins and solder from the holes I heated each one up and bashed it against a table to knock the solder out, then hold it up against a light source to check that it's all gone. Now it's time to install your replacement.
Also - unrelated, but did the source code for v3.5 firmware ever get released?
https://es.aliexpress.com/item/4000075451538.html
It seems that sellers nowadays deal with the most recent "V3" model, which doesn't have the outer screw anymore. Perhaps they can be used unmodded without too many issues? Has anyone here tried them?
Micro you still around?
Those joysticks are hard to source in the usa, any alternatives?
Hi, I guess Micro left this project dead and no longer processing more buy requests for this converter.
Any suggestion where I could find a similar mod or a GC-styled stick replacement for the N64 that doesn't suck? Raphnet's GC to N64 converter won't be available until estimated end of 2022/start of 2023, and I don't have enough money to buy stuff like Steel Sticks.
I would appreciate any answer as the last response was more than one year ago.
8bitdo have released a wireless/BT N64 controller mod kit with a hall effect joystick for those interested, stick can be purchased separately.
Has anyone succesfully updated a v2.2 board with the newer 3.5 firmware? Looking at a v2.2 board I don't see the same six vias to connect the programmer to.
I think these points on the v2.2 board translate to the vias found on the v3 board, but the PCB doesn't seem to be getting any power.
(https://i.imgur.com/9fqJlut.jpg)
avrdude: warning: cannot set sck period. please check for usbasp firmware update.
avrdude: error: program enable: target doesn't answer. 1
avrdude: initialization failed, rc=-1
Double check connections and try again, or use -F to override
this check
avrdude done. Thank you.
Using an up-to-date Windows 11 with the drivers installed as per the firmware update guide.